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PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:46 am 
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To date I have only been experimenting/playing with the notion of including some special f/x into a pano from 2D to 3D.... I hate tacky graphics so I would never consider placing crapy graphics into any of my pano's.. I personally would consider putting special f/x into a pano perhaps since I know how to do it.. There would be some limitations to this but I feel to date I have only scratched the surface of what might be possible...

I was thinking that it would be cool to see a ripple on a lack within the pano scene or fire in an old home/castle fire place or even wall torches.. An early morning mist with the sunlight rippling in the sunlight.. 3D or 2D animated objects are also possible... Even a lip synched 3D character narrating the scene. We already know that its possible to place a movie into a Rectangle, which in my mind is very exciting... Here is a link to very real looking fire and water... The water has been created in Flash.. The fire has been animated in Maya and exported into a swf movie...

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/SpecialFX/SpecialFXinPanos.html

I would be interested in hearing any suggestions for me to try out... or perhaps you might think this wouldn't have any merit at all...

Destiny..

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Last edited by Destiny on Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:53 am 
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Hi Destiny!

Look here: http://krpano.com/docu/

best, Klaus

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:46 am 
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Hi Klaus.. Well.. now I feel like I am a blond girl.. I had no idea that was all there... I did download all the software ages ago but I never really got into it. I really like ptp and apg.. I think its all very cleaver to drop a droplet into a pano and it creates everything... I did not know the other stuff was there.. Its all very very interesting... Now I feel stupid.. so I must be blond.. Thank you so much for telling me.... But its nice to know that others are thinking on the same lines with all the crazy stuff I am thinking off... But perhaps not so crazy after all... If you ever need anything crazy made I will make it for you for free... :)

By the way.. do you have a nice pano photo I can use to try out my water effect... I do not have anything.. I need a nice lake scene... Something with reflections in the water.. Or if anyone else reading this has a pano photo to send me, it would be appreciated...

D..

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Last edited by Destiny on Thu Mar 10, 2011 10:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 11:41 am 
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well.... I found a lake photo for demo.. its looks ok'ish but not perfect... I just need a full pano image to test to see how it looks...

Probably wouldn't be much use for it though...

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/SpecialFX/SpecialFXinPanos.html

D.....

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2011 6:08 am 
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Hi boys.. well.. Destiny has been at it again... Check out my demo showcase silly stuff page....

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/interactive/3/TESTHOT.html

Click on the ? on the menu buttons.... My Thumb nav.... :)

Oh.. and I haven't put any links on the Thumbs yet.. only the first one to Google to test it... I will put links to when I create my full pano tours.... ;)

And sorry, this bit will not work on iDevices.. but there are still thumbs at the top for that.... I will work out a way to do an alt image for iDevices....

D.....

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Last edited by Destiny on Sat Mar 12, 2011 6:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 6:15 am 
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This link below is to test Lip Synch of a character in a Pano... Unfortunately I cannot make the background with an Alpha on a flv movie.... Unless someone knows something I don't... These characters can be 3D Cartoon or even realistic 3D human male/female.. Perhaps has merit as an introduction to the theme of the pano if in a museum, art gallery or public area etc... These are just test for sound and lip synch...

You will find the buttons on the bathroom mirror...

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/LipSynchTest/sound%20test.html
Click on the movie to stop it...

D...

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


Last edited by Destiny on Wed Mar 16, 2011 6:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:17 am 
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Destiny wrote:
This link below is to test Lip Synch of a character in a Pano... Unfortunately I cannot make the background with an Alpha on a flv movie.... Unless someone knows something I don't... These characters can be 3D Cartoon or even realistic 3D human male/female.. Perhaps has merit as an introduction to the theme of the pano if in a museum, art gallery or public area etc... These are just test for sound and lip synch...

You will find the buttons on the bathroom mirror...

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/LipSynchTest/sound%20test.html
Click on the movie to stop it...

D...

Hi Destiny

A bit cheesy! Get it? Sorry, bad humour.

In one of the forums I saw a link to a pano where someone had created a holographic character video to provide an introduction to a museum tour. They seemed to have sorted the alpha, maybe in the video edit program, as opposed to flash video. Sorry, I can't find the link now, bloody internet is too big!

In the right place I think effects can add real value. But subtlety is the key don't you think?

I think the other problem right now is that until iDevice support catches up it is maybe a good idea to hold back a little. There are now so many people consuming a lot of internet content on iDevices, and other non flash supporting mobile devices, that it is important not to ignore them. I wish they would get a move on and finish HTML5. What do you think about that?

I've been playing with rain and directional sound as part of a seascape pano. You can hardly see the rain on some monitors, but it is just there on a decent monitor. Sorry, I can't share the link publicly as it is for a client, but if you are interested in seeing it drop me an email and I will send it.

Mike

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:58 am 
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Destiny wrote:
To date I have only been experimenting/playing with the notion of including some special f/x into a pano from 2D to 3D.... I hate tacky graphics so I would never consider placing crapy graphics into any of my pano's.. I personally would consider putting special f/x into a pano perhaps since I know how to do it.. There would be some limitations to this but I feel to date I have only scratched the surface of what might be possible...

I was thinking that it would be cool to see a ripple on a lack within the pano scene or fire in an old home/castle fire place or even wall torches..

Destiny..

You'll find stuff like that in some of the panos on this site - for example, the first example on this page has subtle animated candle flames for example:

http://www.regal360.com/index.php/vt-projects/1-latest-news/83-the-majestic-hearst-castle.html

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Nikon D5100 and D40, Sigma 8mm f3.5 FE, Nikon 10.5mm FE, 35mm, 50mm, 18-55mm, 70-210mm. Promote control.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:19 am 
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Hi Mike... Thank you for always being so positive about everything... Its always good to hear from you.... emm. unlike **SOME** **:mad:**

;) The mouse cartoon actually came about due to the audio.. One of my students found it on the internet so I thought it would be great for my mouse.. I also downloaded the yellow MM toon audio.... my voice is not as HIGH as his.. :lol:

I have seen some really great special effects in Pano's lately and feel it has some real merit for sure.. Check this link out.. its really cool stuff.. http://www.stadtmaus.de/halloween-special/
I feel if special effects are used they have to work well or it can look really tacky... 'In the right place I think effects can add real value. But subtlety is the key don't you think?' I totally agree... I went on the http://krpano.com/forum/wbb/index.php?page=Board&boardID=18 forum where someone had what they called fire but it looked more like a radiation leak.. not well done at all... I am only just finding out the limitation of ptp... I feel that this software will only get better and even kolor techo's do not really fully know what people like me will try to do with their software...

I have sussed the alpha out with the flv... I just made it wrong.. no problems.. One tip I can give you with video is that, when authoring it using Premiere or Final Cut etc, never use a CODEC.. just render it raw 100% no CODEC.. This way when you drop it into Flash and save it as a flv, the quality is as best you can get without too much lossy.. If you use a CODEC the final file size will be about the same but the video you have used a double CODEC on will be of a lower quality.. There are a couple of CODEC's in Flash by default which are really good for compressing and allowing for streaming of video...

I totally agree regarding your comments on iDevices and HTML5... I believe that very soon their will be some great advancements in this area so I am keeping eyes and ears open and I am also keeping an open mind... If it wasn't for the iPad's I wouldn't bother with iDevices to be honest.. iPhones and iPods etc are just too small to get value from most of the content.... I feel iPads are going to take off in a big way and get better and better and also cheaper.. soon I feel they will be everywhere and when that happens that will be the market I will mostly aim for.. Creating content for iPads... HTML5 is the key to resolving many current problems and issues especially in video.. as soon as this version takes off then the door of opportunity will open wide fore sure...

With regards to your rain.... many people have a pc but do not set their graphics card to fully appreciate the graphic content of the internet... many things I have found effect the users view of content I have made and I am always amazed when they cannot see some content for silly basic reasons... This is why I love the Mac, its just works and works well with all kinds of web graphics...

Chat later...;)

Destiny

MikeMcFarlane wrote:
Destiny wrote:
This link below is to test Lip Synch of a character in a Pano... Unfortunately I cannot make the background with an Alpha on a flv movie.... Unless someone knows something I don't... These characters can be 3D Cartoon or even realistic 3D human male/female.. Perhaps has merit as an introduction to the theme of the pano if in a museum, art gallery or public area etc... These are just test for sound and lip synch...

You will find the buttons on the bathroom mirror...

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/LipSynchTest/sound%20test.html
Click on the movie to stop it...

D...

Hi Destiny

A bit cheesy! Get it? Sorry, bad humour.

In one of the forums I saw a link to a pano where someone had created a holographic character video to provide an introduction to a museum tour. They seemed to have sorted the alpha, maybe in the video edit program, as opposed to flash video. Sorry, I can't find the link now, bloody internet is too big!

In the right place I think effects can add real value. But subtlety is the key don't you think?

I think the other problem right now is that until iDevice support catches up it is maybe a good idea to hold back a little. There are now so many people consuming a lot of internet content on iDevices, and other non flash supporting mobile devices, that it is important not to ignore them. I wish they would get a move on and finish HTML5. What do you think about that?

I've been playing with rain and directional sound as part of a seascape pano. You can hardly see the rain on some monitors, but it is just there on a decent monitor. Sorry, I can't share the link publicly as it is for a client, but if you are interested in seeing it drop me an email and I will send it.

Mike

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:27 am 
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mediavets wrote:
You'll find stuff like that in some of the panos on this site - for example, the first example on this page has subtle animated candle flames for example:

http://www.regal360.com/index.php/vt-projects/1-latest-news/83-the-majestic-hearst-castle.html

Hi Andrew
Yes, very subtle, as opposed to the full on HDR! Took my eyes a minute to 'adjust' but it's in keeping with the grandeur.
Interesting link as it really shows a lot of possibilities.
Mike

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:36 am 
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Destiny wrote:
I have seen some really great special effects in Pano's lately and feel it has some real merit for sure.. Check this link out.. its really cool stuff.. http://www.stadtmaus.de/halloween-special/
I feel if special effects are used they have to work well or it can look really tacky... 'In the right place I think effects can add real value. But subtlety is the key don't you think?' I totally agree... I went on the http://krpano.com/forum/wbb/index.php?page=Board&boardID=18 forum where someone had what they called fire but it looked more like a radiation leak.. not well done at all... I am only just finding out the limitation of ptp... I feel that this software will only get better and even kolor techo's do not really fully know what people like me will try to do with their software...

I have sussed the alpha out with the flv... I just made it wrong.. no problems.. One tip I can give you with video is that, when authoring it using Premiere or Final Cut etc, never use a CODEC.. just render it raw 100% no CODEC.. This way when you drop it into Flash and save it as a flv, the quality is as best you can get without too much lossy.. If you use a CODEC the final file size will be about the same but the video you have used a double CODEC on will be of a lower quality.. There are a couple of CODEC's in Flash by default which are really good for compressing and allowing for streaming of video...

Hi D
Another good link. My head is starting to burst with possibilities.
I'm not using Flash at the mo, but I can see I may well have to dent my credit card sometime soon, there are just a few too many things I can't do right now. And Adobe are talking about/have produced a version that will produce iDevice compatible code.
Thanks for the codec tip. Video is a bit of a nightmare in this regard!
Kind regards
Mike

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:48 am 
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Yes, I agree.. it does show a lot of possibilities.. Beautiful graphics in these panos too.. There are just so many software apps out there that have some feature of value.. Such as the candle flame.. I do not use Corel Draw but I remember somewhere that there is a really nice candle flame feature.. I used it once and it looked really affective... but only as a small flame..

D..

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 12:16 pm 
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You know Mike, you can actually convert many formats of media content to iDevice compatible using Adobe Media Encoder...

I am beginning to play with Adobe After Effects and Motion.. these are two very nice software apps capable of creating some great effects... I just wonder how they will work inside a pano..

Adobe Premiere can save video for use in iDevices too.. And Flash CS5 can create and save content for iPhones and iPads... Apple Touch screens etc... Not sure how it actually works since Flash is not supposed to work inside a iDevice.. so I need to play and test this out.. ITs something to do with the fact that it creates a script and xml code.. As I understand it... If I had more time I would play with it more but I have to work and look after baby too.. so hard for me... especially since I am not a good business lady so to date I have made......... oh yes... 0$... the good news is.. I don't don't pay tax either.. ;)

oh well.. at least I am having so much fun learning and doing what I love to do...

D

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 12:24 pm 
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Destiny wrote:
I have seen some really great special effects in Pano's lately and feel it has some real merit for sure.. Check this link out.. its really cool stuff.. http://www.stadtmaus.de/halloween-special/

Destiny

This was done - like the Hearst Castle panos - using Flash Panorama Player.

This too has a front-end authoring tool - it's called Flashificator, created by an Icelander who lives in Peru (I kid you not). Powerful but with notoriously user 'unfriendly' UI.

As yet neither provides any support for iDevices.

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Many different Nodal Ninja and Agnos pano heads. Merlin/Panogear mount with Papywizard on Nokia Internet tablets.
Nikon D5100 and D40, Sigma 8mm f3.5 FE, Nikon 10.5mm FE, 35mm, 50mm, 18-55mm, 70-210mm. Promote control.


Last edited by mediavets on Thu Mar 17, 2011 12:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 12:26 pm 
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MikeMcFarlane wrote:
But subtlety is the key don't you think?

I definitely support that! :cool:

best, Klaus

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 8:49 am 
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If you like rain Mike.. you might like to check this on out..... ;)

http://www.virtualnorthland.com/panos/halloween/

D

MikeMcFarlane wrote:
I've been playing with rain and directional sound as part of a seascape pano. You can hardly see the rain on some monitors, but it is just there on a decent monitor. Sorry, I can't share the link publicly as it is for a client, but if you are interested in seeing it drop me an email and I will send it.

Mike

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:05 am 
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My fire has taken a on a new phase but its still not quite right yet... Check out this link and go to the second pano in the Pantry test pano..

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/LipSynchTest/sound%20test.html

The issues I still have to resolve would be that fact that for some reason there is a pause between the last frame and the repeat of the first.. might be able to fix this by increasing the frame rate... perhaps a bit more optimising will get it to load bit quicker too.. This fire has two particle elements, fire and smoke.. Once its right I will put it against a real fire place in a castle or nice home etc...

D

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:27 am 
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Hi
Thanks for all the info above, I will have to digest it next week when I have more time.
A few comments on the fire:
- needs a surround to properly border the brickwork. It would just contain the image.
- the background brickwork is too bright. It should be sooty.
- the flames prob actually need to be faster, and a little more random.
- the killer I think though is the light from the fire needs to create light (and shadow which you have) on the background.
Not easy.
Just my impressions.
Mike

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:54 am 
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yes.. right on all accounts.. it still needs lots of work... Perhaps if I set light to Mac it would look more real...:lol:
Its still a bit crappy.... :rolleyes: I will think about it more....

Thanks for that Mike...

D

MikeMcFarlane wrote:
Hi
Thanks for all the info above, I will have to digest it next week when I have more time.
A few comments on the fire:
- needs a surround to properly border the brickwork. It would just contain the image.
- the background brickwork is too bright. It should be sooty.
- the flames prob actually need to be faster, and a little more random.
- the killer I think though is the light from the fire needs to create light (and shadow which you have) on the background.
Not easy.
Just my impressions.
Mike

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 12:15 pm 
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Mike... I have some script for you regarding the Nav Thumbs, but I went to your web site and could not work out how to attach it...

D....

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 6:50 pm 
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Well I have roared the fire up a bit more and put some soot on the brick wall with some more flicker.. but the stupid last frame still pauses from last frame to first.. Not sure how I can fix that... Makes it looks stupid.. I might try a different codec or medium.....

Now I just need some marshmallows... :)

D

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:19 pm 
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..... and my candle lights is starting to take shape... I just need to optimise them more for a Pano....

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/CandleLight/CandleLight.html

Mike, you have the keen eye for detail... what need improving....??

Destiny

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


Last edited by Destiny on Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2011 12:52 am 
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Unbelievable....!!!! I spent hours and hours woking on my Thumb Navigation and there it is, a very similar thing for the grand price of 55 Euro... I might just buy this Flashificatior just to pull it apart.... Amazing, I never heard of it before you told us, Andrew... I do not think it will be that long before common Flash works within all iDevices after HTML5 takes off as well as other platforms being developed.. in fact Flash already does work in iDevices in many forms using AS3... Not sure how since I cannot work a few publishing issues out.. I do not know enough about AS3 to use it... Nothing I know about AS2 is relevant... But Flash defiantly does work within iDevices but only when AS3 created... Just not when using AS2... And since kolor is built on AS2 its a waist of time us anyway...

Destiny

PS,,,, Don't think I will bother.. I downloaded it for trial but then found out I have to buy the Flash Panoramic Player for about 65Aus$ as well then there's the Flashificator for about 75Aus$.... Flashificator asked where the Flash Panoramic Player was located in order to open..

mediavets wrote:
This too has a front-end authoring tool - it's called Flashificator, created by an Icelander who lives in Peru (I kid you not). Powerful but with notoriously user 'unfriendly' UI.

As yet neither provides any support for iDevices.

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


Last edited by Destiny on Sat Mar 19, 2011 1:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2011 4:31 am 
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Hi.. Perhaps someone knows more about AS3 and Flash in a iPhone/iPad then me... Going by everything that Flash suggest, it is possible to load Flash into an iPone or iPad etc, as you can see below in the images there are heaps of setting for this... But no matter what I do, when I open it in my iPod it will not open.. Now, perhaps its due to the fact that my iPod is older than Flash CS5 so this might be the reason why it will not work on my iPod.. But it might work on the current iPone or iPad's..... I managed to get a AS3 graphic to work in a kolor pano, no problems.. I thought only AS2 would work but its not the case.... So then I thought that since there are so many settings for iPads and iPhone that I just had to create a Flash file using AS3 but when I opened it on my iPod... its says... 'Adobe Flash is not supported by any of Apple applications, since it is blocked'... or words to that effect.... So why the hell does Flash provide settings for this???? :rolleyes: Its all very confusing... Some web sites say Flash is supported but only via html5 but other web sites say its not even supported buy html5...

Image

D

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


Last edited by Destiny on Sun Mar 20, 2011 4:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2011 5:09 am 
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Hi Destiny, the iPad does not support flash and it's not going to by the look of things.

Read this apple forum Will iPad 2 support flash?
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:K0NBLIRdNxwJ:discussions.info.apple.com/thread.jspa%3FthreadID%3D2769351%26tstart%3D135%26start%3D30+flash+not+supported+on+ipad&cd=7&hl=en&ct=clnk&source=www.google.com



Best
Gordon

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Last edited by Gordon on Sun Mar 20, 2011 5:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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