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 Post subject: Best 360 Video Options..
PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 4:14 am 
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Hi..

I omitted the 3D 360 options since there are so few at the moment... However, there are lot more 2D 360 video options coming onto the market.. Most of us know about the Freedom360 and the 360Heros.. But.. what else is out there which has potential.. Well.. in my view this one has hug potential.. For one thing, its clear to view and the demo test I feel are still good even though they have been captured under extreme conditions. The underwater demos in my view are excellent.. Its an attachment for the GoPro... and very affordable at about $249 + a GoPro Camera.. The downside its not 180 FOV, which is acceptable since the view it captures at is very nice.. I have posted up this hardware before when they were raising funds, I still think its very good value and good quality output too.. The question I have.. Does anyone have one..

http://eye-mirror.com/cart/index.php?ro ... path=60_62

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/95 ... meras-ocul

http://www.eye-mirror.com/desktopViewer.html

There are other options but some are very expensive.. I have seen an excellent result suggested captured using a LadyBug but.. at 5mp per camera lens I have doubts.. I also hate the web site since the price is a mystery.. You have to ask for a quote.. I cannot be bothered..

Perhaps there will be a bigger version of the Ricoh Theta which captures 360 video.. Who knows. There is also the BubbleCam.. I am still out on that since all of the demos I have seen are not great.. There have been a few more come and go claiming to do wonderful things only to turn out to be expensive door stops.

After loading 20% the Eye Mirror 360 played very well on my internet speed.. Which is not the fastest.. Some demos I have seen from other hardwired units do not work very well at all... Having great new technology is one thing but this media requires the user to have excellent internet connection speed..

To be honest, I was sceptical of this new technology when I first saw it, mostly due to the fact I was unable to view it as it should be viewed... I am not very option to the new media technology.. I feel there is huge potential if the results meet high standards of viewing pleasure...

Destiny..


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 2:23 am 
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Hi..

I have made contact with Thomas Seidl CEO of Eye Mirror regarding road testing his GP Lens. He has no lenses available until May when I will ask again. Andrew (ATXcloud) has agreed to road test this lens since he has some nice new GoPro cameras. I would like to test their other lenses too but this would make a good start..

There is software support for this lens too, which I will also ask for a trail for Andrew to use with his test.. I will also download the software and ask Andrew to send me the 360 video's to test..

One thing I have been pondering since getting more involved with 360 Video, and that is an option to process a 360 Video Tour, perhaps "PTP 360 Video".. I wonder if Kolor has thought on these lines. One thing is certain, all this new media is getting very exciting..

Destiny..


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 8:43 am 
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Destiny wrote:
Hi..

I have made contact with Thomas Seidl CEO of Eye Mirror regarding road testing his GP Lens. He has no lenses available until May when I will ask again. Andrew (ATXcloud) has agreed to road test this lens since he has some nice new GoPro cameras. I would like to test their other lenses too but this would make a good start..
Destiny..

He's been selling this mirror or something like it for years - under another brand/company name as I recall.

Why do you suppose it will be any better than any of the other one-shot mirrors that have been offered over the years?


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 9:19 am 
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Well Andrew... I have tested most of the One Shot Camara lenses but none of them had the quality I can see with the Eye Mirror, or the FOV.. The few demos on their web site have been captured under extreme conditions so I am hoping that Andrew can provide a end user overview.. If I had a GoPro I would do it.. Only time will tell.. Its now up to Thomas Seidl to provide a demo lens and software to test.....

Destiny..


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 1:11 pm 
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Destiny wrote:
Well Andrew... I have tested most of the One Shot Camara lenses but none of them had the quality I can see with the Eye Mirror, or the FOV.. The few demos on their web site have been captured under extreme conditions so I am hoping that Andrew can provide a end user overview.. If I had a GoPro I would do it.. Only time will tell.. Its now up to Thomas Seidl to provide a demo lens and software to test.....

Destiny..


I think this was his previous product:

http://www.pano-pro.com/index.php?route=common/home

http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/thomas-seidl/13/80a/106


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 9:36 pm 
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Yes.. Seems so Andrew..

Destiny..


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 9:45 pm 
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Andrew Mediavets & Andrew ATXcloud... A bit confusing. :lol: It's a good name, wouldn't you agree Andrew? I also go by drew if that helps.

Anyways, Happy to answer any question about the GoPros 360 video. I'm new to video work, so it's been a bit of a learning curve. Appearently 5.6k @ 48fps is a bit much to handle for average consumer GPUs, then doubling up that for the 3D effect in the oculusrift... making it 11k: Kills gpu's.

Hey, is this line of thought correct. Let's say we have a 4000x2000 .mp4. And we plug that into koloreyes... FoV is at 90degrees at a 4:3 aspect ratio. That would effectively make the resolution of the what's being displayed 1000x750?

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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2014 7:27 am 
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Well.. As I have said in the past many times.. New innovations in the 360 are being developed, its just a matter of time before something worthwhile comes along.. This unit apparently is not a fake, its been tested in stealth ......

I feel exciting new Hardware is begin developed by many companies.. This head can soot 3D Video too.. Made for the Oculus Rift among other things...

Very exciting..

Destiny..


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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2014 8:54 am 
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IMO the typical (low) Net connection bandwidth, and high charges for mobile data, will limit to appeal of 360 video in most markets, and that's unlikely to change any time soon.


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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2014 12:13 pm 
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mediavets wrote:
IMO the typical (low) Net connection bandwidth, and high charges for mobile data, will limit to appeal of 360 video in most markets, and that's unlikely to change any time soon.


I agree. Being in constantly contact with many potential clients the common feeling is: wait.

wait for what?

1) Bandwidth. Of course.
2) occasions where 360° video is a REAL advantage - providing more than "just fun".
3) Quality. The quality is good already. But is it good enough for commercial use in advertising? No.
4) Costs: both hardware and software are expensive investments which need to be done first without
knowing about the "return of investment". I saw many undertakings go downby setting too early on new technology.
5) here we have the term "too early". Now: basically it´s never too early for a technology. But it can be too early for investing
in new technology before a market is created.
If you´re lucky you are among the ones who create this new market - but that needs having "a long breath".

We see it with panorama-photography: the markt is flooded with amateurs providing mediocre quality to low costs.
Result A: many small clients paying small money for amateur-work (which doesn´t NEED to be mediocre - but usually definitely IS).
Result B: big clients who are the ones being able to pay appropriate prices for real good work in many cases feel that
"panorama photography is dead" - because the market is flooded with mediocre quality.

The hurdle for amateurs entering the 360 video market definitely is much higher because of higher investments in hardware.
So as a matter of facts it´s done by a bunch of semi-professionals equipped with enough money to take risks.

"Usual" (and real) professionals i know well think wait - "too early". "Let the market clean up itself first - we´ll see which technology survives . . and who is among the "last men standing" :cool:

But there´s a barrier also for potential clients:
how to use interactive 360 video?
where to display it? TV? News video via the web? Online magazins? Advertising on websites? Product promotion on websites?

Aside from News video they all need more bandwidth for displaying 360video content in good HD-quality. So how to make it lucrative?

So: is now the time to step in already?

Klaus


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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2014 12:18 pm 
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Destiny wrote:
I feel exciting new Hardware is begin developed by many companies...


As it´s going on for years already . . . :cool:

Klaus


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PostPosted: Sun May 11, 2014 1:30 am 
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Well, did as Thomas Seidl CEO of Eye Mirror suggested and contact him again this month in the hope of a forum member testing out his GoPro Mirror, but my emails have gone unanswered, so I am assuming its not going to happen.... Real shame since I was hoping to see what this mirror option achieved. I was expecting Thomas to support this independent test to be honest...

The GoPro Mirror is not a lot of money but I personally would not buy one until I read a lot more about it and saw users results. The One Shot Mirror is old technology with past results conducted by me using most of those earlier One Shot Mirror lenses, where the results were not the best. The quality was very poor with most of them... None of them had video support software, but Eye Mirror does..

I guess buy at your own risk and hope.. I would suggest reading reviews and responses to any review before buying.. If anyone does buy one I would love to see some of the results..

Destiny...



Destiny wrote:
Hi..

I have made contact with Thomas Seidl CEO of Eye Mirror regarding road testing his GP Lens. He has no lenses available until May when I will ask again. Andrew (ATXcloud) has agreed to road test this lens since he has some nice new GoPro cameras. I would like to test their other lenses too but this would make a good start..

There is software support for this lens too, which I will also ask for a trail for Andrew to use with his test.. I will also download the software and ask Andrew to send me the 360 video's to test..

One thing I have been pondering since getting more involved with 360 Video, and that is an option to process a 360 Video Tour, perhaps "PTP 360 Video".. I wonder if Kolor has thought on these lines. One thing is certain, all this new media is getting very exciting..

Destiny..


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PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2014 11:27 pm 
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Hi...

I am no fan of the Giroptic past products but.. I am always willing to move on...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hZF9varyAA#t=74

I have asked them for a demo unit to test.. As far as I am concerned, they owe that much to begin to build bridges..

If this performs as advertised, for $299 its certainly affordable.. Heaps cheaper than the Ricoh Theta, which only captures still images. Their claim is that this unit is the World First HD 360 Video Camera.. I wonder who is supporting the stitching software since its done automatically inside the unit..

Destiny...


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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 8:51 pm 
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maybe of interest....

Looks promising:
one row 360video 60fps 20MP still Image Resolution (final render) 4K 360 videoresolution...
... and reallllly nice dimensions...
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13 ... f=category

Georg

PS: realtime videostitching during filming (of course...)
source: http://www.centrcam.com/


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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 10:39 pm 
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There seems to be so many new things being on that KickStart web site.. Often they get their funding...

Not so sure about the FOV with this unit. The stitching on the tips of the air plan wings was a bit iffy too.. I would have to be really cheap to have any sales.... Perhaps you can stack a bunch on top of each other.. ;)

Destiny...

The TimeLaps was interesting... Most of the 360 videos has a lot of double imaging..


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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2014 12:44 pm 
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Destiny wrote:
Not so sure about the FOV with this unit.



http://www.centrcam.com/docs/centrcam_specs.pdf

Klaus


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 7:45 am 
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Hey..

I had a response from Giroptic regarding testing out their new 360 Video Unit... It seems it might be possible in a month or so... Apparently there are not enough units available at the moment... Well, it is a new unit so I can understand that... I will check back in a month..

I never had a response from Eye Mirror so I would consider that to be a NO.. Typical.. I had high expectations that their GP Mirror lens would be better than any of the other One Shot Mirror lenses I tested but... I personally would not buy anything if all I had to go by was the actual manufactures webs site... Hardware like this really needs independent reviews....

Destiny..


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 10:50 am 
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Destiny wrote:
I had high expectations that their GP Mirror lens would be better than any of the other One Shot Mirror lenses



How would it?

Klaus


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 11:45 am 
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The reflective materials are different... The distance from the mirror to the camera lens is far less than the other mirror lenses I have tested... The fact that it uses the GoPro cameras which in itself is nice cameras, all lead me to believe would produce a much better result..

Destiny..


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 11:48 am 
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Destiny wrote:
The reflective materials are different... The distance from the mirror to the camera lens is far less than the other mirror lenses I have tested... The fact that it uses the GoPro cameras which in itself is nice cameras, all lead me to believe would produce a much better result..

Destiny..


The whole 360 (H) pano FOV is still imaged on a single sensor, so resolution will be relatively low, and HFOV always restricted and often asymmetrical around the horizon.


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 11:55 am 
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Well yes Andrew.. I guess until a forum member buys one and test its, all we have to go by is the Eye Mirrors claims.. Their reluctance to provide a demo is not really a good marketing move.. The Kolor forum is one of the biggest in this media area. If the lens performed as they claimed, I would have thought they would have jumped at the opportunity for someone here to showcase its media output.. To date, I have not been impressed with ANY One Shot mirror lens.. I was hoping that this one would be different....

Destiny..


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 12:17 pm 
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Destiny wrote:
Well yes Andrew.. I guess until a forum member buys one and test its, all we have to go by is the Eye Mirrors claims..


Well - i don´t need a manufacturerer´s claim or somebody´s test to recognize physical facts from the specs . . they´re quite obvious:
A single GoPro´s sensor hasn´t enough resolution for imaging the whole 360° in one shot - as Andrew mentioned.
Rigging 6 GoPros changes that completely.

Klaus


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PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2014 12:19 pm 
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Destiny wrote:
The reflective materials are different...


What does that tell us in detail?

Klaus


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PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2014 10:45 am 
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Not 360 video but I will mention this camera anyway.. In a nutshell.. Horrible.!. and that is just a 360 pano image...

I realise that many here like the Theta Ricoh but for the money I am sorry, for me its has to be said... This camera is in serous need of a rethink.. Most of the everyday user results I would say are not worth the expensive of this camera @ about $650 to $700 + Aus.. However the Kolor web site shows that the results can be better.... Not so sure I would use such a camera on the upper end of the real estate market though..

This screen shot is captured from the IVRPA website... Really horrible! If this is the best Ricoh can do, in that case its ONLY going to be good marketing that sells this unit.. not quality of output. Personally I would wait for new and better options.. Sooo much blow out on white light here... Really Ricoh, are these Showcase Images the best you can do....?????? :( and in dim light.. its then a mater of far too much noise in the image... Not sure which is worse.......

Destiny..


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PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2014 11:05 am 
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Destiny wrote:
Not 360 video but I will mention this camera anyway.. In a nutshell.. Horrible.!. and that is just a 360 pano image...

I realise that many here like the Theta Ricoh but for the money I am sorry, for me its has to be said... This camera is in serous need of a rethink.. Most of the everyday user results I would say are not worth the expensive of this camera @ about $650 to $700 + Aus.. However the Kolor web site shows that the results can be better.... Not so sure I would use such a camera on the upper end of the real estate market though..

This screen shot is captured from the IVRPA website... Really horrible! If this is the best Ricoh can do, in that case its ONLY going to be good marketing that sells this unit.. not quality of output. Personally I would wait for new and better options.. Sooo much blow out on white light here... Really Ricoh, are these Showcase Images the best you can do....?????? :( and in dim light.. its then a mater of far too much noise in the image... Not sure which is worse.......

Destiny..


Don´t forget: this is a fun gadget. A toy. You surely wouldn´t use a smartphone for shooting panos for clients, would you.

Aside from the somewhat hefty price "just" for a toy: i guess the Theta is ok for having fun. I know a guy here who´s hapy playing with it.

Don´t expect more from such a device.

Klaus


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