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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 10:20 pm 
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Hello forum.

I want to buy Nikon D800/D800E for maximum 12-shots-panorama resolution, so I have some questions:
1) Is the difference between this cameras significant with fisheye lens? The only advantage of D800E is optical resolution, but is there any fisheye on the market that can handle this difference?
2) What is the best 15-16mm fisheye for this camera?
3) I shoot panoramas with 15-16mm fisheye lenses because it is only 12 shots and it is simple, maybe I buy also some normal wide angle lens for panoramas that worth a problem. What is the best choice of normal wide angle lens for Nikon?

If there will be some examples of panoramas and 100% crops of it from D800 users it will be great.

I use Canon from a start of my photographic career, never use Nikon, so know nothing about Nikon lenses. :(

Thanks alot in advance.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 10:26 pm 
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Lain Iwakura wrote:
Hello forum.

I want to buy Nikon D800/D800E for maximum 12-shots-panorama resolution, so I have some questions:
1) Is the difference between this cameras significant with fisheye lens? The only advantage of D800E is optical resolution, but is there any fisheye on the market that can handle this difference?
2) What is the best 15-16mm fisheye for this camera?
3) I shoot panoramas with 15-16mm fisheye lenses because it is only 12 shots and it is simple, maybe I buy also some normal wide angle lens for panoramas that worth a problem. What is the best choice of normal wide angle lens for Nikon?

If there will be some examples of panoramas and 100% crops of it from D800 users it will be great.

I use Canon from a start of my photographic career, never use Nikon, so know nothing about Nikon lenses. :(

Thanks alot in advance.


The best Nikon Fisheye definitely is the Nikon 2,8/16mm fisheye.

In fact with a 15mm (Canon) and 16mm (Nikon) you need just 5 x 1 Zenith shots @20% overlap when you use a good head and align the camera very precisely.
See it here: http://www.360impressions.de/Wohnung/

Klaus


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 11:43 pm 
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Hi.. Yes, the Nikon 16mm is defiantly the way to go with the D800.. I only have the 10.5 but it auto goto dx, but I have heard others chop the fins off to better use for full frame.. eeek!.. I will never do that with mine.. The 16mm is a good price too compared with the Canon and other fisheyes... This link provides some examples photos.. Being a prime lens, it is sharp...

http://www.pixel-peeper.com/lenses/?lens=60

Destiny..


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2013 12:02 am 
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Lain Iwakura wrote:
Hello forum.

I want to buy Nikon D800/D800E for maximum 12-shots-panorama resolution, so I have some questions:
1) Is the difference between this cameras significant with fisheye lens? The only advantage of D800E is optical resolution, but is there any fisheye on the market that can handle this difference?
2) What is the best 15-16mm fisheye for this camera?
3) I shoot panoramas with 15-16mm fisheye lenses because it is only 12 shots and it is simple, maybe I buy also some normal wide angle lens for panoramas that worth a problem. What is the best choice of normal wide angle lens for Nikon?

If there will be some examples of panoramas and 100% crops of it from D800 users it will be great.

I use Canon from a start of my photographic career, never use Nikon, so know nothing about Nikon lenses. :(

Thanks alot in advance.



A tour here shot with N800E and Nikon 16mm fisheye:

viewtopic.php?f=26&t=19891&p=127971#p127971


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:47 pm 
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hi from Adelaide I just cut the hood of my Nikon 10.5 fisheye to use on d800 the pro photographers that I spoke to said it was the way to go ,reasons given smaller lighter and cheaper also optically better than 16 mm and same resolution with less pics , 360 *180 takes 4 pics on nodal ninja nn5 1 every 90 deg am yet to try it properly hope they are right ha ha ,hoping to get another lens cap to cut up so I can refit hood in situations where needed it just converts back to dx lens 8 pics cheers rolly1


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 4:06 pm 
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rolly1 wrote:
the pro photographers that I spoke to said it was the way to go ,reasons given smaller lighter and cheaper also optically better than 16 mm and same resolution with less pics ,


Sorry - i don´t know which kind of "pro photographers" you know - but this is complete nonsense ;) :cool:

10,5 shaved is a circular fisheye on FX - and a fullframe fisheye on DX.

That means: a circular fisheye on FX gives away a big part of the D800`s resolution due to the much smaller covering the frame.
You save ONE or TWO shots. That means: you save about 10 seconds of shooting-time. WOW :rolleyes:

Using a 16mm Nikon fisheye you shoot 5+1=6 shots - the resolution is about 190 megapixels!

So: it´s just the other way around compared to what your "pro photographers" say:

1) the Nikon 2,8/16mm fisheye is an optically very, very good lens.
2) you don´t need to use it to it´s outer borders becaue it´s a fullframe fisheye: 180° diagonally.
3) A shaved 10,5mm on FX means to to exhaust it to the rim of the projected image. Approching the rim
of it´s projection the performance of EVERY lens in the world weakens drastically. Using the rim itself - that´s what you do by stitching such images - it´s defintely worse: massive loss of sharpness and tons of geometrical-/chromatical abberations.

Resumé:
1) you need to take ONE or TWO shots less. Yes.
2) this saves you about 10 - 15 seconds in shooting . . . but:
3) you loose MUCH resolution - because the image on the sensor is MUCH smaller being a circular projection. About 40% of the sensor is uncovered=black.
4) because of that the resolution of your final result is about half the size as it would be using a 16mm fullframe-fisheye on the D800 . . .
and that for saving just 10 or 15 seconds of shooting time??

Best regards to your "pro photographers" - maybe they´d be better off baking cookies, biking, fishing or whatever instead of being "pro photographers" . . . ;) =D :cool: (sorry - an irony i can´t refuse reading your lines)

btw.: the 10,5mm fisheye even isn´t relevantly cheaper than the 16mm fisheye!

Using a 10,5mm fisheye on a D800 is like driving a Porsche on third-hand tires . . . :cool:

Klaus


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:26 pm 
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Hey Rolly1... eeek's!, you break my heart doing such a thing to a beautiful 10.5mm... I personally would have saved up for the 16mm... That way you get full frame.. I have heard of others doing this but when I researched it, there was so little advantage it was not worth destroying your 10.5mm.. In fact, I would suggest you really need the same number of images to make a full sphere, to be honest.. but you might get away with one image less.. But then that may cause other issues.. I am sure the guys who advised you really meant well.. but perhaps they need to rethink their advise...

http://www.hasselweems.com/photographers/fisheye/

Well, I really hope it does what you expected it would ..

Destiny..

rolly1 wrote:
hi from Adelaide I just cut the hood of my Nikon 10.5 fisheye to use on d800 the pro photographers that I spoke to said it was the way to go ,reasons given smaller lighter and cheaper also optically better than 16 mm and same resolution with less pics , 360 *180 takes 4 pics on nodal ninja nn5 1 every 90 deg am yet to try it properly hope they are right ha ha ,hoping to get another lens cap to cut up so I can refit hood in situations where needed it just converts back to dx lens 8 pics cheers rolly1


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:28 am 
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hi Klausesser thank you for your comments ,I must admit it took a lot thinking and research before I did the nasty deed ,it wasn't only one photographer it was few well regarded local photogs ,the original idea came from Scott Highton you might like read the article on his web site ,then all I found was positive comments from there ,but I guess its possible to follow the wrong path ,but really it doesn't matter the lens has not been damaged I can really get the hood back by cutting up another lens cap , but I must admit the main aim was to take as few shots as possible with moving people in it eg camera club portrait beach shoot say 5 models with 30 photogs doing different types shots in a 360 around camera then taking stills , close ups of the event and putting in ptp 1.8 or 2 etc cheers to all rolly1


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 1:31 pm 
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rolly1 wrote:
hi Klausesser thank you for your comments ,I must admit it took a lot thinking and research before I did the nasty deed ,it wasn't only one photographer it was few well regarded local photogs ,the original idea came from Scott Highton you might like read the article on his web site ,then all I found was positive comments from there ,but I guess its possible to follow the wrong path ,but really it doesn't matter the lens has not been damaged I can really get the hood back by cutting up another lens cap , but I must admit the main aim was to take as few shots as possible with moving people in it eg camera club portrait beach shoot say 5 models with 30 photogs doing different types shots in a 360 around camera then taking stills , close ups of the event and putting in ptp 1.8 or 2 etc cheers to all rolly1



Hi Rolly1!

I know several lads who "shaved" their Nikon 10,5mm fisheye. They´re happy with it, no doubt.

What i meant was your statement:
"the pro photographers that I spoke to said it was the way to go ,reasons given smaller lighter and cheaper also optically better than 16 mm and same resolution with less pics ,"

It´s smaller and lighter. Yes. Maybe it´s a bit cheaper - but not dramatically.

But it´s definitely NOT "optically better than the 16mm" - and it does definitely NOT provide the "same resolution with less pics".

That is pure nonsense, sorry - i wouldn´t excpect "pro photographers" telling such misleading "informations" . .
So i doubt them being real pro photographers.

best, Klaus


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:38 pm 
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hi Klaus yes I made a mistake its been a while since I read the article ,he was comparing a D3 12 megapixel with 16 mm Nikon fisheye with D800 and 10.5 mm fisheye with hood cut off , my apologies about that, please read Scott Highton article on vrphotography.com on the D800 and vr photography ,Nikon Australia ran some free lectures by top pro photographers in Adelaide these people came from Sydney and Melbourne and they all said get the 10.5 mm and cut the hood off and not to get the 16 mm for the same reasons that Scott said in article ,and once again my apologies to all who are reading this for my mistake cheers rolly1


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:47 pm 
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rolly1 wrote:
hi Klaus yes I made a mistake its been a while since I read the article ,he was comparing a D3 12 megapixel with 16 mm Nikon fisheye with D800 and 10.5 mm fisheye with hood cut off , my apologies about that, please read Scott Highton article on vrphotography.com on the D800 and vr photography ,Nikon Australia ran some free lectures by top pro photographers in Adelaide these people came from Sydney and Melbourne and they all said get the 10.5 mm and cut the hood off and not to get the 16 mm for the same reasons that Scott said in article ,and once again my apologies to all who are reading this for my mistake cheers rolly1



Hi Rolly!

Ok. No problem. But you don´t need a D800 then, do you . . =D :cool:

best, Klaus


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 11:38 pm 
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well if you want to take a 360 * 180 pano with 4 photos in theory the higher megapixel camera the better which is probably the only case they might be right ,it will be interesting to see what kind of results I get ,one thing I did try Klaus and Destiny was 10 - 20 sigma dx lens at 10 mm without hood in fx mode and that did not seem to work very well at all ,and that's the lens that I used all the time on my robot with great results just too many pics with moving subjects , Destiny Nikon Australia recommended a place in Brisbane to send my 10.5 to get the hood cut off can't remember what it was called but it ended up being just photo studio let you know if I can remember cheers rolly1


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 12:09 am 
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Hi Rolly1... I wonder why Nikon did not just design their lens to remove the fins in the fist place. When I first heard about cutting the fins off a 10.5mm, I was kind of shocked but curious.. So I investigated it.. Some say its a good thing but some say, it did not make much difference.. I too found a place that had a service to cut the fins off but it was expensive.. I personally thought it was bit of a gimmick.. Perhaps I should have just bought the 16mm in the fist place and used it on my D90, I am sure it would fit but just crop the images.. The 16mm is a nice lens but so is the 10.5... For me, I would not cut the fins off since I do not feel their is much benefit in doing so.. When I looked at images After the fines have been cut off and looked at images captured using a 16mm full frame, .. there is no comparison.. Set the D800 camera to shoot max large with the 16mm fisheye and you will have huge sharp panos.. But, on the other hand, using a robot, a 50mm prime would be even better.. and that is a really cheap very sharp lens.. It just takes a lot longer to capture a full sphere pano.. So I guess there are huge advantages in using a 16mm fisheye.. Sharp, full frame, huge images/spheres and less images so much quicker and less chance of errors..

I would love to see your After chop pano you make.. and to hear about your evaluation now you have done the deed..

Destiny...


Last edited by Destiny on Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:40 am, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:07 am 
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Why doing this cutting thing when there is 8mm sigma lens on the market? :/

Also thanks alot for your comments. Im still thinking about what camera to buy - D800 or D800E, but (thanks to your replies) got it about lens.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 1:51 pm 
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Destiny from what I gather most fisheye lenses have fixed hood the only one that does not I think is a zoom fisheye I think that is made by Tokina and remember I did it because I want to take 360 shots with movement in it, much easy with 4 pics than 6 ,8,10 or 15 etc ,even better with one shot options that you can get but they are low res or very dear , Lain a lot of fisheye lenses on full frame cameras need the hood cut off from what I read on the net not just the Nikon 10.5 the sigma 8mm and other fisheye lenses have problems with soft edges or vignette badly or both after lots reading vr web sites ,magazine reviews I came to the conclusion that I had 2 choices Nikon 16 mm or Nikon 10.5 ,I also came to the conclusion that all fisheye lenses sounded like they needed updating from all brands , d800 or d800E all I can say is if you intend using say F1.4 to F4 D800E if most of your pics are taken at F4 to F36 D800 if not much diff in price D800E I love my D800 best camera I ever had big diff in price when I got mine cheers rolly1


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:02 pm 
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rolly1 wrote:
Lain a lot of fisheye lenses on full frame cameras need the hood cut off from what I read on the net not just the Nikon 10.5 the sigma 8mm and other fisheye lenses have problems with soft edges or vignette badly or both after lots reading vr web sites ,magazine reviews I came to the conclusion that I had 2 choices Nikon 16 mm or Nikon 10.5 ,I also came to the conclusion that all fisheye lenses sounded like they needed updating from all brands , d800 or d800E all I can say is if you intend using say F1.4 to F4 D800E if most of your pics are taken at F4 to F36 D800 if not much diff in price D800E I love my D800 best camera I ever had big diff in price when I got mine cheers rolly1


Only if using those designed for use in DX/APS-C sensors bodies on fullframe sensor bodies.

The Sigma 8mm has no 'hood' and was originally designed for use with fullframe sensor bodies to produce a full circular image, but has been popular with pano shooters using DX/APS-C bodies on which it produces a cropped circular image offering almost 180 FOV on the long axis of the sensor.

Tokina produced a version of the 10-17mm zoom fisheye after they spotted that many people were 'shaving' off the 'hood' so they could use it on fullframe sensor bodies.

IRRC Samyang also produced a version of their 8mm f3.5 fisheye with a removable 'hood'.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 11:55 am 
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If I have bought a Canon Camera I would have probably have bought the Canon EF815L L-Series Zoom Fisheye EF 8-15mm f/4L Lens by now.. I had a play with it at the camera shop.. Its very sharp as far as I could see.. but probably the most expensive of all the fisheye lenses... It has no fines ether..

Destiny..


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:42 pm 
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hi destiny back to work today yuk not happy, fine on the canon fisheye I must admit in all the forums that I have looked on I have never read a single comment about canon fisheye lenses ,yes if the Nikon D70 wasn't arguable better than 300d at the time I would have 5d mk 3 instead of D800 to many lenses to change ,been a few changes with fisheye lenses since I looked at them there's a new Samyang with removable hood as they said the sigma 8 mm has removable hood , I wonder if Nikon will grow up ha ha ,by the way the sigma 150 to 500 zoom creeps pointed down but ok pointing up so I am told by one owner cheers rolly1


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