batch process Neutralhazer  

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caretaker360
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batch process Neutralhazer

by caretaker360 » Wed Sep 05, 2012 6:24 pm

Anyone have any ideas to get this to batch process ? I have 600 aerial photos to run through this ...
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Christian Stüben
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by Christian Stüben » Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:38 pm

Hello caretaker,
i have the same problem. And i have asked here in the forum too, several weeks ago. No usefull answer until today. There really seems to be no solution for us. Bad luck.

Hi kolor guys, what about a feature request "neutralhazer batch processible in Photoshop"?

greetings from germany
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by caretaker360 » Mon Oct 08, 2012 3:26 pm

The only way I have found was to use the dehaze plugin in Autopano. It creates s set of dehazed images but with no control , just "autommatic" .
Well better than nothing I guess.

A little dissapointed from the Kolor staff, no replies, no comments nothing..
Evolution invented panoramic vision, Kodak invented the 4:3 format.

Nikon D2x, 7000. Glass: 10.5 fe, 14mm asph, 20 , 50, 105, 24-120, 70-200
Panogear, BT dongel , Nokia n800 , PC's on W7 ..... now that I look at this, everything but time!

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ygilquin
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by ygilquin » Tue Oct 09, 2012 1:43 pm

Sorry for the late answer. Let me try to explain why batch processing is not enabled in Neutralhazer.

As you may know, when Neutralhazer filter is launched, it starts by scanning the input image to create the haze map. It's the preliminary step that happens before preview is displayed. User settings allow planes positioning and corrections based on this map, and you should understand "in a relative way". What I mean is identical settings on two different images won't produce the same result. That's why batch processing cannot be enabled, as values cannot be "ported" from one image to another one.
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Christian Stüben
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by Christian Stüben » Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:07 pm

ygilquin wrote:That's why batch processing cannot be enabled, as values cannot be "ported" from one image to another one.

Are you sure? When using neutralhazer from within autopano, then only one picture is analyzed and previewed from the operator. And this setting is used in batch for all the pictures for this pano.

I would prefer to use neutralhazer before on the same pictures from inside photoshop, because inside photoshop it gives much more choices to optimize the photos.

Simply telling "cannot be enabled" is false.

greetings from germany
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Last edited by Christian Stüben on Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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by ygilquin » Tue Oct 09, 2012 3:40 pm

You're right and... you're wrong.

When using neutralhazer from within autopano, then only one picture is analyzed and previewed from the operator. And this setting is used in batch for all the pictures for this pano.

Right ! But, this does not mean the same result is obtained for all the images, as the setting is only a percentage applied to the map computed for each image. That's what I was trying to highlight in my last comment, and I beg your pardon if I wasn't clear enough. I definitely understand this is not very intuitive as it's not the way usual image processing plug-ins are working.

Simply telling "cannot be enabled" is false.

Sorry Chris, but you're wrong there. It cannot be enabled because we chose to prevent it in order to avoid user disappointance when applying the same "apparent" settings to a bunch of images, and getting filtered images that do not receive the same haze removal amount. This is a design decision of Neutralhazer for Photoshop.

Please tell me if this is a bit more clear rephrased this way.
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by klausesser » Tue Oct 09, 2012 5:00 pm

ygilquin wrote:You're right and... you're wrong.

When using neutralhazer from within autopano, then only one picture is analyzed and previewed from the operator. And this setting is used in batch for all the pictures for this pano.

Right ! But, this does not mean the same result is obtained for all the images, as the setting is only a percentage applied to the map computed for each image. That's what I was trying to highlight in my last comment, and I beg your pardon if I wasn't clear enough. I definitely understand this is not very intuitive as it's not the way usual image processing plug-ins are working.

Hi Yann!

Let´s get this straight here: i use NH in APG. I take one image and set the values which i found appropriate. Then i say "apply to all images" (or whatever it´s named). Starting the process the NH analyzes each image and matches my settings to all of them individually?

That´s great!

best, Klaus

PS: or are you saying that my once found values get applied to all images per centage - without analyzing each image individually?

In this case (which i guess) it´s vital to select a representative image for finding a setting to match all images. It´s the same as it is with HDR/processing-settings - you must find one setting wich fits all images in the right way.
Last edited by klausesser on Tue Oct 09, 2012 5:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Christian Stüben
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by Christian Stüben » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:01 pm

ygilquin wrote:Right ! But, this does not mean the same result is obtained for all the images, as the setting is only a percentage applied to the map computed for each image.

Hmm, what i read is ... from within autopano, neutralhazer analyses each picture individualy, and decides to make different settings for each picture, and only a coarse adjustment from the setting the user choose from the one picture he himself decided to be representative?

There must be
... settings that say what is foreground, what is background, and how much they have to be cleared from haze. These settings should be the same for all pictures in one batch.
... a unique haze map for each picture, that (in combination with the settings) tells your algorythm how much each pixel must be cleared.

Hmm, the content of each pic is different, one contains more foreground, the other more background, so the haze map / foreground-background map will differ (in this point i agree). But all pictures should be filtered with the same "clearing settings". Otherwise the result will get too different.

Or is the way your dehazer works too different from other filters?

greetings from germany
Chris
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by klausesser » Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:12 pm

Christian Stüben wrote:Hmm, the content of each pic is different, one contains more foreground, the other more background, so the haze map / foreground-background map will differ (in this point i agree). But all pictures should be filtered with the same "clearing settings". Otherwise the result will get too different.

Regarding haze usually becomes evident on somewhat longer distance - most likely the haze is more or less uniform for most pictures. For that reason i guess it´s sufficient to
find an ideal setting for one image which the represents all images for being treated.

best, Klaus
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Christian Stüben
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by Christian Stüben » Wed Oct 10, 2012 8:24 am

klausesser wrote:Regarding haze usually becomes evident on somewhat longer distance - most likely the haze is more or less uniform for most pictures. For that reason i guess it´s sufficient to find an ideal setting for one image which the represents all images for being treated.
best, Klaus

Yes, that´s the point i try to talk about. One setting for all batch pictures, but kolor doesn´t like it ... deep sigh :(

greetings
Chris
Last edited by Christian Stüben on Wed Oct 10, 2012 8:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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klausesser
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by klausesser » Wed Oct 10, 2012 12:17 pm

Christian Stüben wrote:
klausesser wrote:Regarding haze usually becomes evident on somewhat longer distance - most likely the haze is more or less uniform for most pictures. For that reason i guess it´s sufficient to find an ideal setting for one image which the represents all images for being treated.
best, Klaus

Yes, that´s the point i try to talk about. One setting for all batch pictures, but kolor doesn´t like it ... deep sigh :(

greetings
Chris

One or two times i used NH in APG a year or so ago it worked fine that way :cool:

best, Klaus
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Christian Stüben
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by Christian Stüben » Wed Oct 10, 2012 3:47 pm

klausesser wrote:One or two times i used NH in APG a year or so ago it worked fine that way :cool:

Yes i tried this too, you can see the result in my Mariahilfberg pano (the view to Neumarkt). It works fine. But from within Photoshop the filter gives much more choices for fine tuning (oops, right words?).

greetings
Chris
Last edited by Christian Stüben on Wed Oct 10, 2012 3:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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