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PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 7:57 am 
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Hi.. Thanks for all the emails of support.. Yes, sorry I killed that thread off due to too much verbal bullying… So at your request I have started it again.. If however it attracts bigheaded bulling comments I will kill it again for good…

Here are some 3D Interactive TESTs.. I am not so sure about the html5 webGL option.. Here I have put up 5 3D models in different formats to test them for loading. I am not sure how long each of them will take to load your end but the Old Steam Engine and Statue were the slowest for me, but only a few minutes. Anyway.. I would appreciate you Georg and Ed, and who ever else with constructive criticisms, to test them for loading time and interactive movement…. Perhaps I can then determine the best option for others to use when the time come where webGL can be loaded directly into a ptp tour.

There is a particle cloud process for 3D scanning which is an option but although the file sizes are much lower, the technology to 3D scan is very expensive, but it will scan in full colour too… I think perhaps stay away from mesh and do it using Nurbs.



I look forward to the day where objects like particle systems - fountains, water, fire and clouds or other moving or still object can be placed directly into a tour and viewed in all angles. To pan round or even walk round a fountain or fire would be really cool…. To check out an ancient vase or bone would be really cool. 



There are five-hotspots here so you will need to pan the VR Grid round…. There are bucket loads of coding here so I hope it all works your end....



http://members.westnet.com.au/DPS/webGLStuff/HTML5Stuff/index.html

Destiny

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2012 9:56 pm 
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Yes sorry, and thanks for the couple of email feedbacks... On my Mac keyboard you can use your Shift+L/Mouse to move XY on the stage area.. The Zoom in and out is using your mouse wheel or with my its a Magic Mouse to I can just move my finger over the face to Zoom... You can hold your L/Mouse on the 3D object to rotate but you can also initiate a mouse lock up by taking the mouse over the boundaries of the state area and the let go of the mouse.. The 3D models will then rotate without holding down the mouse button. One click on the stage will end mouse lockup...

Some feedback so far on loading are: Steam engine 1 minute 30 seconds and Statuette 1 minute 50 seconds......Office about 45 seconds to load.

At my end the Steam Engine takes 2.5 mins but the Office take 2sec.. so very different.... Soon 3D objects like the Office, will have hotspots on them to use for navigation within your VR Tours... A kind of 3D map.... :)

Destiny...

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 8:02 am 
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Destiny wrote:
There are bucket loads of coding here so I hope it all works your end....



http://members.westnet.com.au/DPS/webGLStuff/HTML5Stuff/index.html

Destiny

Hello Destiny,
unfortunatley this will not woirk on my pc. When i click the link, i get a windows with a grid, and two blinking i.
Then i click one of the i, somwthing like a pop up windows coms, first white, then a blue-white backgground, Modeled by Destiny at the bottom, but nothing more. My System is Win 7 ult 64, Chrome 21.0.1180.89 m, Adobe Flash updated yesterday.
IE 9 told me that Chrome Frame must be installed. After accepting to install and activation ... Browser does not seem to support WebGL, then same blue-white as on Chrome.

What is missing, what might go wrong?


Greetings from germany
Chris

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 8:07 am 
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Again me ... i have left the browser windows open for getting some tea, and now more than 15 minutes later the bulldog clip has appeared (Chrome). Loading of the models takes eternity.

greetings
Chris

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 8:23 am 
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Hi Chris..

Wow, that is a long time.. The Bulldog Clip was modelled using NURBs so no polygon mesh as such, so it should have loaded very quick. Feedback so far is the Bulldog Clip and Office are the quickest taking only a few seconds.. The Statue takes about 3 minutes. I had a Rhino plug-in which was terrible.. Huge files sizes so basically useless.. Now here is a thing.. If I open a webGL in Chrome on my Windows using the Rhino it opens ok.. Yet some do not.. I am wondering if there is a difference between webGL itself and the way its created.. With Safari the Bulldog clip opens very quick. But there again for others who have contacted me via email there does not seem to be an issue on their side.. Very strange.. Thank you for testing that... Its the feedback I need.. Perhaps I can narrow down the issue and make adjustments accordingly.. Kolor are working on the inclusion of webGL in ptp.. It would be nice if I can find a great setup for others to use to create the 3D content to use with ptp webGL when its available to add it to our tours.....

The Grid Scene you see is actually a pano tour.. You can use your mouse to pan round same as a normal virtual tour.. I replaced the Grid images just for testing.. There are five hotspots to test different 3D objects...

Destiny...

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


Last edited by Destiny on Wed Sep 12, 2012 10:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 8:29 am 
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Chris.. Alex J might have an answer with your Chrome issue since they use this as their front line testing for webGL with their kolor eye software...

Destiny..

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:26 am 
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Hi Chris.. How did you know that the "Chrome Frame must be installed". The thing is.. I cannot view my 3D in Chrome at all... But ok using Safari... Did it tell you or did you change something.. I might be able to write into the html5 code to download it automatically...

Destiny....

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 10:11 pm 
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Hi.. I have a bit of a theory…

When you are sent a 3D pdf via html, it will not open; you have to open the actual pdf app for it to be viewed.

The Rhino webGL html5 plug-in is all embedded so I am unable to see the actual 3D contents of the package, which makes the entire file huge, so perhaps they have embed the dae player with it…

The software I am now using adds a dae, or COLLADA file, into the folder. Now, if I were to open a dae on my Mac, it defaults to the Preview Window, standard with all Macs. I could however open it using the free glc-player to view the 3D dae file.

In Windows, it does not have a default Preview for 3D. Therefore I have to open the glc-player to view the 3D content…

…, webgl is a free app using JavaScript. If the 3D were to be created via code within this app then its all good.. However, if a third party content were to be added, like a dae 3D file, I think this is the same issue as with a 3D pdf; It needs an app to view the 3D content.. Therefore, the software I am using may not work very well at all with most users, which means many of you will not see the 3D contents since you are relying on a third party app to play the 3D contents.

Perhaps the reason why I can view the 3D contents in Mac is the fact that its piggy backing off the Preview Player in my Mac, and the reason why I can not view the 3D dae file in Windows Chrome, is due to the fact that there is no default 3D player....

Oh hum… my head hurts!!

Destiny…

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


Last edited by Destiny on Wed Sep 12, 2012 10:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:03 pm 
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Destiny wrote:
With Safari the Bulldog clip opens very quick.

I use a MacPro 2x3GHGz Xeons, 8 cores, 16GB RAM and i have a 32000 cable. I run the actual Safari version and have WebGL activated of course.
Bulldog clip takes about 5 min. to load.

Please clear you Safari-cache before reloading the pano . . . :cool:

Klaus

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 11:58 pm 
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Considering the file size, it takes far too long.... Mine takes just 2 secs to load so I wonder why yours, with a better setup than mine, takes a lot longer... The other 3D modles are a lot bigger so they will take forever at that rate... Thank you for testing it Klaus... There seems to be a lot of variables to consider with the webGL media....

Destiny

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:38 am 
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Thank you Ed for testing that.. You seem to have the best results so far... I think there is something I am missing to allow others to achive the same results...

oh hum... I have to go an pick up my students from music.. emmmmmmmmm ;( Long live Term Break!!! LOL

Destiny..

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 9:56 am 
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Hi Destiny,
today i tried again ... bulldog loades within a few seconds, the car too.

So the problem seems to be the first and initial load when no objects are in cache. Once the 3d objects are cached, all works fine.

greetings from germany
Chris

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 10:12 am 
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Oh.. Well there you go, but they should still load quicker... I will work on that... Thank you for the feedback. Did you work out that its a 360x180 pano with a 6 Point Perspective Grid.. My 3D sphere.. :lol:

Destiny....

PS.. Mine take 35 sec's with an empty cache but 3 sec's with data in the cache... Still a bit slow..

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


Last edited by Destiny on Thu Sep 13, 2012 10:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 10:41 am 
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Yes indeed Ed.. I must have done it a million times over these past few months testing this 3D stuff... No point in relying on my cache to suggest its all working fine... I guess this is why I am asking others to test the download speed, oh durrrrr!... Thank you for giving credit for knowing an obvious thing... I will leave it to others to show me how to suck eggs... :lol: Two years ago I was IQ tested.. I scored 152.. but I was very tired on the day.. :lol::lol::lol:

Destiny...

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 11:11 am 
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Artisan S. wrote:
Quote:
Please clear you Safari-cache before reloading the pano . . . cool

Again a denegrating remark based on a postulation that holds no ground.....disrespectfull and velline....don't you think someone who can program stuff like what Des is showing is as stupid as not to clear her cache doing a download speed test.

Ed - that´s again one of those remarks from you basing on nothing but unexperience with that what you´re talking about.

let´s talk FACTS instead of insulting:

Safari on Macs often keeps data in it´s cache which doesn´t get updated all the time - kind of a bug i guess and no problem if you´re aware of it.

So it´s common use among people using Macs with Safari to clear the cache each time re-loading a site when it´s about to test the site´s behaviour.

EVERYONE who is working intensively on web-content and tests it on his/her Mac using Safari forgets this sometimes - definitely i do regularly - and so it´s an friendly and ironic joke among Mac-users to advise each other clearing the Safari cache before running a speed-test.

So i would be very pleased if you would think first and shoot later - instead of giving us the Mitt Romney here . . :rolleyes:

Klaus

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Last edited by klausesser on Thu Sep 13, 2012 11:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 11:16 am 
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Destiny wrote:
Yes indeed Ed.. I must have done it a million times over these past few months testing this 3D stuff... No point in relying on my cache to suggest its all working fine... I guess this is why I am asking others to test the download speed, oh durrrrr!... Thank you for giving credit for knowing an obvious thing... I will leave it to others to show me how to suck eggs... :lol: Two years ago I was IQ tested.. I scored 152.. but I was very tired on the day.. :lol::lol::lol:

Destiny...

Good Lord, Detiny . . . i give up trying to share friendly jokes with you.

Guess you found a very much better matching counterpart than me to discuss things with: Ed. :lol:

Klaus

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 11:19 am 
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Christian Stüben wrote:
Hi Destiny,
today i tried again ... bulldog loades within a few seconds, the car too.

So the problem seems to be the first and initial load when no objects are in cache. Once the 3d objects are cached, all works fine.

greetings from germany
Chris

You´re completely right, Chris!

I tested it again some minutes before: 90sec. for the clip. Still too long for real use - and that´s a very simple model.

best, Klaus

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 11:51 am 
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Artisan S. wrote:
.the fact is that you dear to think someone like Des doesn't know that as well....and youre constant use of a dismissive tone of voice is...

Ed - i definitely don´t care about your or Destiny´s IQ :D My remark about the Safari cache was a kind of running joke common among Mac-users. Nothing more and nothing less. Your interpretation is ridiculous - but not surprising i mean.

Artisan S. wrote:
Klaus, so you can defend yourself all you want.....and call me (and Des) stupid (as I think you imply with your Romney quote)

Ed - 1) i don´t need to "defend" myself and 2) regarding Romney: read yesterday´s news. I don´t know - and definitely wouldn´t like to need judging it - his IQ, but what he stated was the wrong claim at the wrong time. Driven by the impulse just to say anything of "importance" to wheedle the TeaParty.

I didn´t and i don´t call anybody "stupid" - especially not without knowing him/her in person at all.

Klaus

Btw.: i´m tired of this kind of "discussing" things - definitely.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 11:52 am 
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Actually Klaus.. I fully understood your humour with your cache remark, being a Mac user.. but I chose to ride on Ed's remarks since he respects me for my skills and knowledge and you don't .. So until you learn to respect my skills and knowledge I will regard your humour as 'patronising'..

Now here is an interesting web site.... I am sure I have seen the actual Office demo but I cannot find it to view it.. Interesting use of the term 3D here...

http://labs.blitzagency.com/?p=388

Destiny...

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 11:57 am 
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Actually speed might change Ed over the day... Mine gets very slow over the evening as users log on.. Real pain.. Australia is rolling out a new High Speed Internet System.. Costing zillions.. $$$

Destiny..

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:03 pm 
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Destiny wrote:
but I chose to ride on Ed's remarks since he respects me for my skills and knowledge and you don't . So until you learn to respect my skills and knowledge I will regard your humour as 'patronising'..

I definitely respect the skills and knowledge of anybody. That can´t mean obligatorily sending flowers for literally everything he/her does . . . :D:cool:

"I will regard your humour as 'patronising'.."

No problem. I´ll keep it back . .

Klaus

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:08 pm 
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.. and one of the links on this web site will open this... http://flashpanoramas.com/blog/2007/05/23/add-some-life-to-panoramas/
Check out the image on the desk... Now, for me, this is what a Virtual Tour should have and heaps more.. It adds a sense of 3D realism and engaging interest into the Virtual Tours. To pan and zoom for me has never been enough.. I have a vision for the future and my goal is clear. I will continue to experiment with new technologies as I become apprised of them.. Its all very exciting... I realise you can do the interactive images already but this one is done well...

Destiny...

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


Last edited by Destiny on Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 13, 2012 2:41 pm 
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Artisan S. wrote:
.....and these guys show how they did it or at least how they could have done it.

http://renderstuff.com/creating-virtual-360-panorama-cg-tutorial/

That´s what we made here:

http://www.360impressions.de/SpecialsTVSpot.html

The labels/images are 2D here - but there´s another version with 3D generated packages of movie-DVDs
instead of the flat labels/images.

So you can use 3D objects moving inside the panorama-sphere being recorded by a "free flying" camera.

I did this several times with rendered cars and smaller objects inside our HDR-spheres as background and IBL source - established technology for years.

I have a small rendering of a chrome-object inside a sphere - the whole panorama-scene mirrors on the object as the camera moves around it. That was in 2006 -
one of the first panos i did using AutoPano (handheld btw).

I´ll look for it.

Klaus

PS:

That´s a *real* 3D animation i made about 2006 afaik: (both are Quicktime movies)

www.klausesser.de/boomS3.mov

here´s a mixed 3D/pano-sphere animation - a functionality-test using C4D around 2008:

www.klausesser.de/tt2wkl.mov

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 10:09 am 
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Hi.. I forgot to follow up with what Chris said above regarding the "Chrome Frame"... This is not an issue with Safari but with Chrome it is.. You need to install this to view webGL content when using Chrome in Windows.. Bit silly really, not sure why its not part of Chrome in the first place.. If you have popups blocked you might not even know this...

Destiny...



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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


Last edited by Destiny on Sat Sep 15, 2012 10:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:54 am 
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Hi.. Some things work well but others, not so well.. Perhaps this has no merit but it might if I can make it look right... Its hard to get a holographic look.. I can get it to work inside a Pano window with no issues but I have lost a bit of direction along the way with it... I had an idea but its not what I really wanted.. but I thought I would post it here anyway... Perhaps the Koala looks a bit scary... ;)

http://members.westnet.com.au/DPS/3DHolographicTest/3DHolographic.html

Destiny

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


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