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Why not let the photographer help Autopano - new feature?

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 9:44 am
by macbenutzer
Hi all,

(i tried to search this topic but maybe i used the wrong keywords. Sorry if this has been posted before.)

Is there a feature to help Autopano to assamble the images or is it planned in a future release?

When i take a panorama or a partial image i normally know what i am doing!

My question: why can i not help Autopano with this knowledge when trying to assamble the images. Would it be possible to tell Autopano: "look Autopano, i did a partial panorama, aprox. 120 degrees wide, maybe 45 degrees high, 3 rows, 5 lines with a 5 bracket set from a tripod." If i could pass this - very valuable! information - to Autopano it could guess much better the position of a clear blue image in the sky for example. As one would not take an image of the sky, then the bottom, then the right corner, then the left above sky ;-)

Why not share this information with Autopano? We could help each other to get a better result with less effort :)

Just a thought - Peter/360pixel.de

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 10:21 am
by mediavets
I am puzzled.

Your signature states that you have a Merlin robotic pano head.

If that is the case why don't you use the Papywizard XML format data file, optionally created when shooting a pano using Papywizard to control the Merlin mount, with the APP/APG Papywizard Import wizard. (The Seitz VRDrive2 and the Panogear/T&C Touch controller can also generate Papywizard-compatible XML format data files).

This will achieve exactly what you seek. It will provide APP/APG with information about the shooting pattern assisting the placement of 'featureless' images, such as images of clear blue sky.

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:06 am
by a a gruntpuddock
This feature is not available in Autopano Pro, options are free or single row/ column.

However, if you go into 'move pictures' mode, it is easy enough to manually align shots, especially when they have been taken in a regular pattern.

Adding additional alignment options as suggested by macbenutzer would be a benefit though.

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:25 am
by HansKeesom
actually, in the editor I sometimes tell autopano the degrees it should use. It can be a very precise way of getting the nadir shots to line up

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 11:27 am
by mediavets
a a gruntpuddock wrote:This feature is not available in Autopano Pro, options are free or single row/ column.

.

Which feature are you referring to?

The Papywizard Import wizard is available in both APP and APG - via File/Import:

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 1:37 pm
by macbenutzer
Well, i did not use my Merlin for a long time - by the way, where is it?? :)

Of course i could use and edit the XML-file manually, but this is not the way the Autopano GUI is supposed to be. Alexandre and his team do think a lot on GUI i guess and editing a XML-file by hand is not the way they want to go. It is a workaround but not an easy solution.

Just think of a small panel popping up before the recognition is started saying "Any details known on this project? Enter them here." There you could enter the number of rows, lines, brackets and this information would used by Autopano as "hint" where to put images and what to do with orphaned images. It would be a very easy and totally hasslefree way to get a very valuable information about a project. No more orphaned images or "sub-panorama" in a project!

Maybe i just would like to have something like this as i am more of a photographer than a programmer ;-)

Peter

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 2:09 pm
by a a gruntpuddock
Thanks mediavets - a bit of APP I had vever explored!

Pity the supplied options do not match the pattern I set for my home-grown pano head, but it's nice to know they are available.

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 2:11 pm
by mediavets
macbenutzer wrote:Just think of a small panel popping up before the recognition is started saying "Any details known on this project? Enter them here." There you could enter the number of rows, lines, brackets and this information would used by Autopano as "hint" where to put images and what to do with orphaned images. It would be a very easy and totally hasslefree way to get a very valuable information about a project. No more orphaned images or "sub-panorama" in a project!

Maybe i just would like to have something like this as i am more of a photographer than a programmer ;-)

Peter

You do not need to use the Merlin mount - although I'm not sure why you wouldn't.

You do not need to edit/create an XML format data file by hand.

Just try using Papywizard in simulation mode configured to emulate your shoot and create an XML format data file.

I think you will find - as others have - that the Papywizard Import wizard will do a fair job of assisting APP/APG with the placement of featureless images. The Papywizard-compatible XML foirmat data file will provide just the sort of 'hints' that you are describing.

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 2:42 pm
by klausesser
mediavets wrote:(The Seitz VRDrive2 and the Panogear/T&C Touch controller can also generate Papywizard-compatible XML format data files).

The Merlin-version of T&C TouchControl also does it with the Merlin. There´s a Merlin-version and there´s a Panoneed-version.
Both of them write XMLs for APG´s PapyWizard-import.

best, Klaus

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 3:01 pm
by mediavets
a a gruntpuddock wrote:Thanks mediavets - a bit of APP I had vever explored!

Pity the supplied options do not match the pattern I set for my home-grown pano head, but it's nice to know they are available.

Are you talking about the Gigapan Import wizard shooting pattern options? - screenshot 1.

Papywizard can be configured for many different mosaic shooting pattern options - screenshot 2.

What pattern does your home-grown robot use?

The Gigapan Import wizard assumes that camera/lens is mounted in landscape orientation becasue that's the only option with Gigapan robots.

Papywizard allows the system to be configured with the camera/lens in either the portrait or landscape orientation - screesnhot 3.

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 3:17 pm
by a a gruntpuddock
I have two patterns, depending on whether I want to shoot in rows or columns.

In either case, it starts at the top left corner then trundles along one row/ column, shifts, then reverses direction.

So, in the case of columns (my preference), it goes down, across, up, across, down.

Did it that way because it saves the time and battery power compared to always starting the row or column at the same end.

I did not bother looking at the 'input' options before because I assumed you had to have used one of the commercial heads to prepare all the relevant files, etc.

Think I will try an old pano again using these options, I had to spend some time setting the sky shots by hand but that may not be necessary.

PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2012 3:38 pm
by mediavets
a a gruntpuddock wrote:I have two patterns, depending on whether I want to shoot in rows or columns.

In either case, it starts at the top left corner then trundles along one row/ column, shifts, then reverses direction.

So, in the case of columns (my preference), it goes down, across, up, across, down.

Did it that way because it saves the time and battery power compared to always starting the row or column at the same end.

Papywizard can be configured to start from any corner, and to shoot by row or by column, and to reverse at end of the row or column or to go back to the start of the next row or column.

So it should be possible to configure Papywizard for a simulated shoot that matches the pattern shot by your home-gorwn robot.

Papywizard only allows one value for overlap % which is applied to both axes - becasue normally it will be calculating adn controlling shooting positions. However this doesn't seem to matter too much when using it to assist placement of images shot using a different robot or even manual pano head.

Just configure Papywizard to match your camera/lens setup and shooting pattern and estimated overlap %, then specifiy the simulated mosaic shoot by entering number of rows and columns and you should be able to generate an XML format data file to use with the Papywizard Import wizard and your own images.

I did not bother looking at the 'input' options before because I assumed you had to have used one of the commercial heads to prepare all the relevant files, etc.

Not necessarily so.

Think I will try an old pano again using these options, I had to spend some time setting the sky shots by hand but that may not be necessary.

Look forward to hearing whether this workaround is useful for you.

............

My proposal for what I termed a Generic Matrix Import wizard was for something more like the Gigapan Import wizard. But with more shooting pattern options, the ability to specify either portrait or landscape orientation for the camera/lens, and the ability to specify both an estimated vertical overlap % and an estimated horizontal overlap %.