placing a video in PTP  

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Destiny
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by Destiny » Sat Feb 26, 2011 5:44 am

emm.. The thing is.. Kluas has to make two different formats anyway since the normal settings will not work on an iDevice anyway.. he has to make one pacifically for an iDevice..

He will have to have two url's, one stating iDevice compatible... When he makes a pano for an iDevice it will be highly optimised to work.. where as on a normal browsing situation the images and files will be much bigger for quality of viewing... Would it not??

D
Last edited by Destiny on Sat Feb 26, 2011 8:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

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by mediavets » Sat Feb 26, 2011 12:17 pm

Destiny wrote:emm.. The thing is.. Kluas has to make two different formats anyway since the normal settings will not work on an iDevice anyway.. he has to make one specifically for an iDevice..

He will have to have two URLs, one stating iDevice compatible... When he makes a pano for an iDevice it will be highly optimised to work.. where as on a normal browsing situation the images and files will be much bigger for quality of viewing... Would it not??

D

I believe you are mistaken.

The 'mobile compatibility' feature/functionality of PTP/krpano allows you to create a tour that incorporates two versions - one for Flash-capable platforms and one for iDevices.

The HTML file runs a javascript that determines which version to load based on the user-agent value returned by the browser.

Using multi-res tiling, different resolution versions are delivered to each type of platform (Flash or iDevice) accordingly.

So you do not need to create two different tours with two different URLs.

This tour demonstates that - view it from a Flash-capable browser/platform and then from an iDevice and you'll see that you cannot zoom in as much when viewing with an iDevice (or with Safari on a PC with the user-agent configured as a iDevice):

http://www.camus.pro/npbcvisite/npbcvv.html

Screenshot 1 - max. zoom in, Windows XP, Safari browser, user-agent configured as Safari 4.0.5 for Windows loading the Flash version of the tour.

Screenshot 2 - max. zoom in, Windows XP, Safari browser, user-agent configured as Mobile Safari 3.22 for iPad loading the iDevice version of the tour.




Last edited by mediavets on Sat Feb 26, 2011 12:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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by klausesser » Sat Feb 26, 2011 2:23 pm

Destiny wrote:oh.. show me a demo... So I can see on my iDevice and my browser.. I am still confused as to what you are doing...or saying...

D

Hi Destiny!

I received your mail - thanks a lot!! I´ll try it in the afternoon.

best to you, Klaus
Simplicity is the keynote of all true elegance. Coco Chanel

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by Destiny » Sat Feb 26, 2011 11:32 pm

Well there you go.. thats what I wanted to see.. Now I understand some of it... Its all in the script and images created for both in ptp... But no matter what I do, I cannot get the hotspot to work unless I create ones pacifically for iDevices.. Even if I put the default hotspots into it from ptp, they default to yuck, slow acting rings when opened in an iDevice... These must be some kind of embedded gifs or as you say they change by defult... But I notices you had the same hotshopt on your pano no matter if viewed in Safari or iDevice, they remained as you made them.. I am still not understanding something.. I think there might be an assumption of knowledge here and without actual written instructions its a matter of playing with it... If I make a normal pano for Safari, I can use my own swf or the default hotspot which are just gifs but they all work.. no problem.. If I make a true gif with transparent background, they work on an iDevice very well but not in Safari.. I am missing something for sure... but you have proven its works.. Nice pano too..;) I had a thought, when ever anyone sends me a gif in an email, it never works... so I though perhaps its a Mac or Safari issue... but then your hotspots would not work so its not that...

OK,,, can you please write step-by-step..how to do... before my brain explodes!! Do I have to do something in the xml file??

D


I believe you are mistaken.

The 'mobile compatibility' feature/functionality of PTP/krpano allows you to create a tour that incorporates two versions - one for Flash-capable platforms and one for iDevices.

The HTML file runs a javascript that determines which version to load based on the user-agent value returned by the browser.

Using multi-res tiling, different resolution versions are delivered to each type of platform (Flash or iDevice) accordingly.

So you do not need to create two different tours with two different URLs.

This tour demonstates that - view it from a Flash-capable browser/platform and then from an iDevice and you'll see that you cannot zoom in as much when viewing with an iDevice (or with Safari on a PC with the user-agent configured as a iDevice):

http://www.camus.pro/npbcvisite/npbcvv.html

Screenshot 1 - max. zoom in, Windows XP, Safari browser, user-agent configured as Safari 4.0.5 for Windows loading the Flash version of the tour.

Screenshot 2 - max. zoom in, Windows XP, Safari browser, user-agent configured as Mobile Safari 3.22 for iPad loading the iDevice version of the tour.
Last edited by Destiny on Sat Feb 26, 2011 11:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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by klausesser » Sat Feb 26, 2011 11:47 pm

Destiny - the animated circles work as sequence when viewed on an iPad - but are not moving on a "usual" machine.
PanoTourPro generates compatible versions which run on both platforms.

The gif animated hostspots you sent me pulse on iPad - but only the biggest circle shows non-animated on a usual machine.

maybe i can convert them to png and get them running.

best and thanks again, Klaus
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by klausesser » Sat Feb 26, 2011 11:59 pm

mediavets wrote:Using multi-res tiling, different resolution versions are delivered to each type of platform (Flash or iDevice) accordingly.

No. Multires doesn´t work on iDevices. There just are two fixed image sizes: one for iPhone and one for iPad. Multires, as i learned, doesn´t work on iDevices because of low processor-power and RAM.

http://www.camus.pro/npbcvisite/npbcvv.html that´s fine - but it uses the ugly buttons . . i need the white circles because all of our panos have them :cool: and i want to keep them.

best, Klaus
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by HansKeesom » Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:04 am

Klaus,

not on topic, but http://www.camus.pro/npbcvisite/npbcvv.html suffers from a lot of CA (chromatic abberation)

Are you aware of it, do you normally correct it?
Regards, Hans Keesom
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by klausesser » Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:11 am

HansKeesom wrote:Klaus,

not on topic, but http://www.camus.pro/npbcvisite/npbcvv.html suffers from a lot of CA (chromatic abberation)

Are you aware of it, do you normally correct it?

Hey Hans!

That´s not one of my panos - Andrew linked it as an example :cool:

best, Klaus
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by HansKeesom » Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:12 am

pffffff I almost started to doubt about you :-)
Regards, Hans Keesom
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by klausesser » Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:16 am

HansKeesom wrote:pffffff I almost started to doubt about you :-)

:cool:
But it´s nicely photographed!

best, Klaus
Last edited by klausesser on Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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by mediavets » Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:27 am

Destiny wrote:OK,,, can you please write step-by-step..how to do... before my brain explodes!! Do I have to do something in the xml file??

D

On Flash-capable platforms the tour is played by the krpano Flash Pnaorama Viewer. Flash can play SWF files but it does not play animated GIF files as animations.

On iDevices the tour is played by HTML5 and Javascript krpano player and this cannot play SWF files but can play animated GIFs as animations.

The default themes (2D, 3D Glowing and Sketch) implement animated hotspot graphics (termed sequences) in a way that works with both the Flash Panorama Viewer and the Javascript viewer.

So if you want to create your own hotspot graphics that will perform with both players - without your having to delve into the XML or creating two separate tours - you need to do it in the same way as it is done in those themes.

How? Well, create your own theme based on one of those default themes. A theme just comprises some XML code and graphics.

From within PTP choose Edit/Open templates dirdcetory... and you'll find the folders and files that make up the theme templates. Inspect those files and I think you'll be able to figure out how the themes are designed/structured. Then using one as a model create your own.
Last edited by mediavets on Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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by Destiny » Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:32 am

Yes I know Klaus.. its ok.. I have just understood what M has been saying.. NOW I UNDERSTAND.. I will send you new ones later.. That will work.. promise.!!.. ...I hope!:lol:

klausesser wrote:Destiny - the animated circles work as sequence when viewed on an iPad - but are not moving on a "usual" machine.
PanoTourPro generates compatible versions which run on both platforms.

The gif animated hostspots you sent me pulse on iPad - but only the biggest circle shows non-animated on a usual machine.

maybe i can convert them to png and get them running.

best and thanks again, Klaus

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by mediavets » Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:40 am

klausesser wrote:
mediavets wrote:Using multi-res tiling, different resolution versions are delivered to each type of platform (Flash or iDevice) accordingly.

No. Multires doesn´t work on iDevices. There just are two fixed image sizes: one for iPhone and one for iPad. Multires, as i learned, doesn´t work on iDevices because of low processor-power and RAM.

Well, as I understand, it your statements are both true and not true...

My understanding is that the ability to create one tour which comprises two variants (one for Flash capable platforms and one for iDevices) which are dynamically selected via a script depending on the user-agent value of the browser, is that it's based on the multi-res tiling technology of krpano...BUT that the iDevice variant of the tour is restricted to displaying only the lower res level(s) of the multi-res tile hierarchies.

Hand coding for krpano (rather than using PTP) Hans Nyberg has reported (on panoguide.com) creating, as I recall, a three variant tour setup - which delivers different variants for Android 2.2 Flash, iDevices and non-Android Flash capable platforms (Android 2.2 Flash can handle multi-res but not to the same level of resolution as more powerful Flash capable platforms due to memory restrictions). Many of the panoramas linked from the home page of his web site are now setup like this I believe:
http://www.panoramas.dk/

http://www.camus.pro/npbcvisite/npbcvv.html that´s fine - but it uses the ugly buttons . . i need the white circles because all of our panos have them :cool: and i want to keep them.

best, Klaus

See: http://www.autopano.net/forum/p78238-today-23-27-19#p78238
Last edited by mediavets on Sun Feb 27, 2011 1:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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by klausesser » Sun Feb 27, 2011 2:46 am

Hi Andrew!

Klaus (KRPano) wrote me that multires don´t work on iDevices yet because of processor-power and RAM. Maybe we see on iPhone/-Pad the first step of tiling - but i think we see one of the two sizes made for iPad and iPhone. They´re in the data-folder.

I dealt with multires on iPads some weeks ago when i did a 3,4 Gigapixel - www.klausesserstudio.com - for a client and we thought about making it run on iPads. Didn´t work with multires.

Maybe it will be possible using the upcoming generation of iDevices which have double- and quad-core processors and much more system-RAM.

The same is using videos inside of panos. A sound plug-in is available as beta actually.

See here for video-included: www.360impressions.de/Baselfilm.html - on "usual" machines a movie runs on the screen. On iPads it doesn´t.
Safari in simulation-mode of iPad shows the movie running - but on iPad it doesn´t run.

best, Klaus
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by Destiny » Sun Feb 27, 2011 6:19 am

Ok Klaus.. I have worked out all about your hot spots.. I know how to make them, and how to edit them in xml... They are not what I thought they were.. What I have already sent you are wrong.. I will send you new ones.. I can send you the Flash fla file if you want it too.. am using CS5 but I can save to CS4 if you have Flash, you will need it to edit the size of them as required.. The problem with resizing in Photoshop would be they are Vector in Flash and I have saved them as 24bit png.. if you resize them in Photoshop they will pixulate..

In the xml file you can change the size, if you do not then you will see parts of the hotspot showing.. So what ever width you make them you need to change the xml file.. easy to find, it defaults at 65.. so change all those to what ever size you make the width of your hotspots... Its really easy to do.... You can make changes to this anytime even after uploading if you want to change the look or type of hotspot or even the size of them...

The hotspots work on scripted code using a 24 bit png strip... Easy when you know how.. Why would you need to resize, well, on a small iDevice they are sized in relationship to the pc or mac pano and look ok.. as a consequence they can be small, especially on a iPod.. I would expect they look a lot better on an iPad... Probably not a real problem then... Anyway.. check out the demo link below.. they are all black, but you can make them any colour and size you want... There are two above the bath and one middle of the door... I guess it will all come down to what size you want...

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/interactive/3/TESTHOT.html

If you want a step-by-step tutorial on how to make them I will put it together for you.. Just let me know... Happy to do it for you...

This pano demo is set only to full image size, so you can expand your finger to zoom etc.. but you will see the hotspots will not resize..... which in many ways is good..

I have put video into an iDevice but the RAM and Hard Drive size of my iPod is really restrictive for this..

D...

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by mediavets » Sun Feb 27, 2011 6:38 am

klausesser wrote:See here for video-included: www.360impressions.de/Baselfilm.html - on "usual" machines a movie runs on the screen. On iPads it doesn´t.
Safari in simulation-mode of iPad shows the movie running - but on iPad it doesn´t run.

best, Klaus

That URL doesn't work.
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by Destiny » Sun Feb 27, 2011 6:39 am

Hey Andrew.. I have just changed the percent of the hotspot in the xml file from 10% to 15%.. I wouldn't want to make them any bigger.. Is there any part of the code where I can change the size for the iDevice ONLY... I then went back to my png graphic and made that bigger so it wouldn't pixulate so much and then put it back to 10%.. The hot spots look better on a normal Mac Safari viewing but I still cannot change the size of the hot spot on the ipod view.. Also.. why would the thumb images be so small.. I can change them in xml but thats a pain if I was doing it all the time...

D
Last edited by Destiny on Sun Feb 27, 2011 7:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

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by Destiny » Sun Feb 27, 2011 9:03 am

Your tour works well on my ipod and loads quick, but the hot spots could do with being a bit bigger.. Your thumbs are good, but mine go very small... why would that be.. I think on an ipad your tour and hot spot would look very nice.. I would probably use a different hotspot to that of Klaus is using.. I am only playing around with that style since it seemed to be the issue at the time... I would probably use my own nice arrows.. I am glad I finally managed to work out how to create and manage hotspot, thank you for all your help... I think if I had an iPad I would appreciate your pano more..

D:D

This tour demonstates that - view it from a Flash-capable browser/platform and then from an iDevice and you'll see that you cannot zoom in as much when viewing with an iDevice (or with Safari on a PC with the user-agent configured as a iDevice):

http://www.camus.pro/npbcvisite/npbcvv.html
Last edited by Destiny on Sun Feb 27, 2011 9:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

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by mediavets » Sun Feb 27, 2011 9:33 am

Destiny wrote:Your tour works well on my ipod ..

D:D

This tour demonstates that - view it from a Flash-capable browser/platform and then from an iDevice and you'll see that you cannot zoom in as much when viewing with an iDevice (or with Safari on a PC with the user-agent configured as a iDevice):

http://www.camus.pro/npbcvisite/npbcvv.html


It is not mine - it's a tour made by someone else which I used to illustrate a point.
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by mediavets » Sun Feb 27, 2011 9:35 am

Destiny wrote:... why would the thumb images be so small.. I can change them in xml but thats a pain if I was doing it all the time...

D

Did you specify the thumbnail size in pixels or as a percentage?

The thumbnail looks tiny in the Flash version too for me.


Last edited by mediavets on Sun Feb 27, 2011 9:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Nikon D5100 and D40, Sigma 8mm f3.5 FE, Nikon 10.5mm FE, 35mm, 50mm, 18-55mm, 70-210mm. Promote control.

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by mediavets » Sun Feb 27, 2011 9:41 am

Destiny wrote:.. I am glad I finally managed to work out how to create and manage hotspot, thank you for all your help... ..

D:D

You now have a whole new business opportunity - creating and selling custom themes for Panotour Pro. ;)
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Nikon D5100 and D40, Sigma 8mm f3.5 FE, Nikon 10.5mm FE, 35mm, 50mm, 18-55mm, 70-210mm. Promote control.

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by Destiny » Sun Feb 27, 2011 10:35 am

Oh I wish.. I know so much but when I come across something very new like this it throws me off track...

mediavets wrote:You now have a whole new business opportunity - creating and selling custom themes for Panotour Pro. ;)

If only i could make money out of something I am doing... Teaching suck!!.... Well.. correction... teaching is great.. its the clients that suck!!... As soon as I get my pano head back.. something missing from it... I will find a nice location to take a great pano tour.. then HOPE i get work making pano movies... I don't want to get rich, I just want to buy nice things for our little girl...

By the way... I shorted out the thumb thing.. I did not change anything when I created it... but the 'Row' went to 4 which threw the whole thing out.. I have put thumbs in before but not as an iDevice setting and they have all be ok.. it might be a glitch.. I will check it next time.. Easy to fix though......

Soo... is there a way to change the scale of a hotspot on an iDevice??? independent of the normal sizing which works fine..

D

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by mediavets » Sun Feb 27, 2011 11:09 am

Destiny wrote:
mediavets wrote:You now have a whole new business opportunity - creating and selling custom themes for Panotour Pro. ;)

If only i could make money out of something I am doing... Teaching suck!!.... Well.. correction... teaching is great.. its the clients that suck!!...

Isn't that true of any and every sort of business - it would be fine but for the customers!

I expect the Kolor guys feel the same way - at least sometimes - about software development and us! (or at least about me) ;)

This guy makes 'skins' (similar to Panotour Pro themes) for Pano2VR:
http://www.hopkimedia.co.uk/pano_skin_packs.html

And here's someone offering animations:
http://skins.360panotours.com/

As soon as I get my pano head back.. something missing from it... I will find a nice location to take a great pano tour.. then HOPE i get work making pano movies... I don't want to get rich, I just want to buy nice things for our little girl...

Don't undersell your tours. My observation of reports from all around the world is that domestic real estate tour work usually pays badly except at the very high end. Commercial real estate, hotels, and tourism seem to be markets that will pay more for top quality work if it is marketed to them creatively. But don't spend so much time on it that your daughter never gets to spend time with you; she'll value your attention, care and time more than 'nice things'.

Soo... is there a way to change the scale of a hotspot on an iDevice??? independent of the normal sizing which works fine..

D

I don't have a ready answer to that question, but I don't know of a way to do which wouldn't involve editing the XML and that's not a viable user-friendly approach; so I think it would require changes to PTP so that it incorporated this automatically when generating the XML for the tour. It could be a fixed variation in scale or one could perhaps envisage it being a user configurable scaling factor in the GUI.
Last edited by mediavets on Sun Feb 27, 2011 11:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Nikon D5100 and D40, Sigma 8mm f3.5 FE, Nikon 10.5mm FE, 35mm, 50mm, 18-55mm, 70-210mm. Promote control.

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by Destiny » Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:50 pm

Thank you Andrew for all that.. all good advice.. Its not what you know, its who!!....

I just fixed my thumb size. and put a nice new drop button that looks neater... just to play and see.... Can't stand yucky graphics..
I tried blue circles but you can hardly see them on my iPod so it will be important to make sure the correct hotspot and colour when creating pano's for both pc/mac and iDevice's... I think I will work on how to scale the iDevice hot spots independently...

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/interactive/3/TESTHOT.html

Off to bed ... bye...

D

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by mediavets » Sun Feb 27, 2011 1:05 pm

Destiny wrote:I tried blue circles but you can hardly see them on my iPod so it will be important to make sure the correct hotspot and colour when creating pano's for both pc/mac and iDevice's...

D

Now you have grasped the method of making animated hotspot graphics that work on both Flash and iDevice platforms using the technique Kolor developed for themes - and right now you are one of the few who does - then you'll be able to make a theme which includes all the hotspot styles you wish.

If you make a theme that supports colourising then of course you'll be able to choose a colour for each and any theme hotspot graphic just as with the 2D theme.
Last edited by mediavets on Sun Feb 27, 2011 1:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Andrew Stephens
Many different Nodal Ninja and Agnos pano heads. Merlin/Panogear mount with Papywizard on Nokia Internet tablets.
Nikon D5100 and D40, Sigma 8mm f3.5 FE, Nikon 10.5mm FE, 35mm, 50mm, 18-55mm, 70-210mm. Promote control.

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