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It's here..It's here

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 1:36 am
by tarnis
Well the head arrived 2-3 weeks ahead of schedule, should have the bluetooth module tomorrow and praying the cable by the weekend(thanks Claude). Anyways I thought something didn't seem right about it and I guess I Was right...there's another something I'm needing it would appear to set the nodal point...Should I have purchased/built a focusing rail, or some sort of long strip to move the camera backwards on? Anyone have a good picture of there setup for wide-angle?

I'm assuming I can just strap on my 400mm though and go fire away once the rest arrives still?

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 2:07 am
by Gordon
The supplied dove tail focusing rail can work, but it depends on what camera you have and lens of course.
If you let us know your lens and camera, someone here may already have the same or similar equipment with the nodal point issues already solved.

Gordon

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 3:19 am
by tarnis
I have a 20D, a 50mm 1.8, a 100mm macro and a 400mm 5.6 canon lenses. Thanks :)

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 9:52 am
by claudevh
Hi Matt,

I hope that your cable/connector will arrive today ...

Concerning the NPP settings please have a look hereafter:
http://www.autopano.fr/wiki/action/view/T%C3%AAte_astronomique_Multi-fonctions_Merlin_Adaptation_M%C3%A9canique (in French only ...)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3a/All_Camera_to_be_pub.pdf

According the last doc (pdf), no modification are required for your Canon 20D ...
I am not "expert" in Gigapixel, but I thing that the NPP is not important with 400 mm lenses.

Have fun
:cool:

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 9:58 am
by Paul
claudevh wrote:I am not "expert" in Gigapixel, but I thing that the NPP is not important with 400 mm lenses.

for sure:
NPP doesn't matter with long lenses, as you don't have crispy foregound objects without focus stacking

I don't adjust NPP with lenses above 150mm

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 10:09 am
by mediavets
claudevh wrote:According the last doc (pdf), no modification are required for your Canon 20D ...
Have fun
:cool:

That depends on the diameter of the lens barrel which can be so large that it is not possible to attain NPP without modification of the 'crown'.

As mentioned previously it's not an issue when shooting scenes - for example, distant landscapes which are often the scenes chosen for gigapixel panos - with nothing closer than about 100mm, or with longer focal length lenses.

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 2:53 pm
by tarnis
I understand, but what I am asking is how do I move the camera forward and backwards? It's just an L bracket...is there another piece I can find cheaply at the hardware store readily made or do I need to rig something.

Image

What was included allows me to move the camera verticaly and horizontally but no way to align the front of the lens with the nodal point.

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 2:55 pm
by DukeNukeIt
Just curious, with the Canon 24-104mm IS L lens, does the NPP shift when using the zoom function, or is it the same over the entire range of the zoom?

Would it be a better option to go with a "Prime" lens for the best results, or are nominal zoom lenses ok (200mm or less).

Thanks for any help, I'll be purchasing a new lens soon :)

Dave

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 3:03 pm
by mediavets
tarnis wrote:I understand, but what I am asking is how do I move the camera forward and backwards? It's just an L bracket...is there another piece I can find cheaply at the hardware store readily made or do I need to rig something.

http://www.metagraphical.com/tmp/nodal.jpg

What was included allows me to move the camera verticaly and horizontally but no way to align the front of the lens with the nodal point.

Dismantle the L bracket - it is in two parts held together with two bolts. Then use the part with the mounting screw in the dovetail and you can mount the camera in portrait mode.

Alternatively make a dovetail rail - Frank (bigwade) had one made from hardwood purchased at a DIY store by a local cabinet maker.

I purchased an additional longer dovetail rail from an astro store.

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 3:06 pm
by mediavets
DukeNukeIt wrote:Just curious, with the Canon 24-104mm IS L lens, does the NPP shift when using the zoom function

Dave

Yes.

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 3:14 pm
by Paul
tarnis wrote:What was included allows me to move the camera verticaly and horizontally but no way to align the front of the lens with the nodal point.

you can see the mod of the bracket here (in french):
http://www.autopano.fr/wiki/action/view/T%C3%AAte_astronomique_Multi-fonctions_Merlin_Adaptation_M%C3%A9canique

or google-auto-translated here:
http://translate.google.de/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.autopano.fr%2Fwiki%2Faction%2Fview%2FT%25C3%25AAte_astronomique_Multi-fonctions_Merlin_Adaptation_M%25C3%25A9canique&sl=fr&tl=en&hl=de&ie=UTF-8

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 4:15 pm
by bigwade
tarnis wrote:I understand, but what I am asking is how do I move the camera forward and backwards? It's just an L bracket...is there another piece I can find cheaply at the hardware store readily made or do I need to rig something.

http://www.autopano.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=4867&p=3

http://tinyurl.com/dll47m

grtz!

PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2009 10:29 pm
by tarnis
Ahhh...ok, now I get it. Unfortunately being in french and the final pictures not really showing how the camera is mounted I wasn't quite visualizing it all. Mediavets description helps alot though. Hopefully have the rest of the parts tonight!

Thanks,
Matt

PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 3:20 am
by tarnis
Well went out for an initial test run and kinda disappointed... not sure if it's one thing or several. The software seemed to be running ok-ish on vista on my laptop after some fiddling around with changing bluetooth stacks. Got home from work, slapped on the camera and it seemed to be working so I drove downtown and setup and everytning that could go wrong pretty well did from that moment.

Is anyine else running Papiwizard under vista? I'm going to try and free up enough space to dualboot to Ubuntu but I'm not sure if that's the problem or not. It ran very slow and just froze randomly or the head would stop moving when it says it is moving and other bizarre issues. Finally I got fed up and was done but before packing I re-ran the same pano in simulation mode and papiwizard was responsive and worked fine(of course the head wasn't moving). *sigh* got me worried about this little investment, I mean you get what you pay for but I'd like something that works at the same time :)

PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 7:53 am
by fma38
I suspect a bluetooth issue (transmission problem)... Could you try with a serial cable, instead of the BT link?

PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 12:20 pm
by tarnis
Where would I get such a cable? I'm sure I have a serial cable around somewhere but nothing that would go into an RJ-11 jack.

PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 12:50 pm
by mediavets
tarnis wrote:Well went out for an initial test run and kinda disappointed... not sure if it's one thing or several. The software seemed to be running ok-ish on vista on my laptop after some fiddling around with changing bluetooth stacks. Got home from work, slapped on the camera and it seemed to be working so I drove downtown and setup and everytning that could go wrong pretty well did from that moment.

Is anyine else running Papiwizard under vista? I'm going to try and free up enough space to dualboot to Ubuntu but I'm not sure if that's the problem or not. It ran very slow and just froze randomly or the head would stop moving when it says it is moving and other bizarre issues. Finally I got fed up and was done but before packing I re-ran the same pano in simulation mode and papiwizard was responsive and worked fine(of course the head wasn't moving). *sigh* got me worried about this little investment, I mean you get what you pay for but I'd like something that works at the same time :)

May I suggest that you run some more testing.

You don't need to attach the camera - if it's a BT issue then there's no need to bother with the camera.

Just try running some shoots, with the head connected but without the camera, and if you can repeat the problem post the log files here.

Incidentally which camera body and lens were you using when you had the problmes?

PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 12:52 pm
by mediavets
tarnis wrote:Where would I get such a cable? I'm sure I have a serial cable around somewhere but nothing that would go into an RJ-11 jack.

That would require a different TTL-RS232 interface - and you don't have one.

So let's concentrate on getting your BT-TTL interface working.

Papywizard generally has no problems when working the the default Microsoft BT stack (at least that's the case with Windows XP).

If you delete any third party BT software then allow the OS to install default BT stuff it should work OK.

Are you using a built-in BT device or a USB BT adapter?

PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 1:01 pm
by fma38
Sorry, I though you have the Tronisoft module (RS232-TTL), plus a RS232-BT converter... If you only have the BT-TTL converter, you can't lake tests.

But as Andrew said, just set the logger level to TRACE (last TAB in the config. dialog), run some commands, and send me the log.

PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 2:12 pm
by tarnis
I'm using the parallax module and a built in toshiba bluetooth card...I may pick up a usb module to see if that works any better.

Vista doesn't have hyperterminal which the website suggests using to see if commands were being sent so I tried with PuTTY on com4/5 which according to the bluetooth control panel were the ports being used for incoming and outgoing. I can't seem to login and use papywizard at the same time.

My big problem with logs is when the head stops I hit the stop button but I'm guessing it is waiting a command from the head before it will truely 'stop' which never happens so I cannot close the shooting window to get access to the log on the main screen.

bt device is on com5 outgoing and com6 incoming btw

PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 4:24 pm
by claudevh
Hi Matt (Tarnis),

As said by Andrew, be sure that the BlueTooth Stack is wel the Microsoft or the Widcomm/Broadcom, the Python module for Bluetooth is only able to run with one of those 2!

Then could-you follow the next steps in the order suggested ...

1. Be sure that the batteries are fresh ...

2. Plug in the "original remote controler" and ,when the power is applied, see if some of the buttons are "blinking" or not.

3. Use the original remote controler in all axes in order to see if the head respond normally, you can also try to use the "cruise and shot" mode and see if the head respond normally.
Please do those tests with "unloaded" and "loaded" mount !

4. Power the head off ... and plug the Parallax module into the "Aux" connector, apply the power and see if some of the buttons are "blinking" or not.

5. Test the working of the Head trough Papywizard with my "cable/connector" and with your "self-made cable/connector" and see if you get the same behavior of the Merlin/Orion/Sky-Watcher.

If one of the proposed step fail, please report ...!
Waitng for your experiments.

:cool:

PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 4:53 pm
by tarnis
Tried all that :) Same issues. I'm going to try and pick up a bluetooth adapter tonight kinda heading out of town for the weekend and was hoping to be able to use this. Stuff it all in the car and see what happens.

PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 5:00 pm
by Paul
Hi Matt,

I have a very strange effect on my Merlin:

It does not run via BT if I don't plugin a phonecord with min. 3m wire in the second RJ12 jack.
The other end of the phonecord is connected to nothing.

Whenever I unplug the phonecord, connect PW to BT-module works, but Merlin not.

PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 5:31 pm
by mediavets
tarnis wrote:I'm using the parallax module and a built in toshiba bluetooth card...I may pick up a usb module to see if that works any better.

Vista doesn't have hyperterminal which the website suggests using to see if commands were being sent so I tried with PuTTY on com4/5 which according to the bluetooth control panel were the ports being used for incoming and outgoing. I can't seem to login and use papywizard at the same time.

My big problem with logs is when the head stops I hit the stop button but I'm guessing it is waiting a command from the head before it will truely 'stop' which never happens so I cannot close the shooting window to get access to the log on the main screen.

bt device is on com5 outgoing and com6 incoming btw

Did you uninstall all third-party BT stuff?

Papywizard connects via either direct BT connection or via virtual COM port under XP on my system using default Microsoft BT stack/driver and BlueNext BN-01 USB-BT adapter (a tiny low cost device bought via eBay).

Same USB-BT adapter requires Widcomm divers and connection via virtual COM port with Windows 2000 - but Win2K lacks built-in MS BT drivers (MS never produced them for Win2K).

PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 8:37 pm
by fma38
tarnis wrote:bt device is on com5 outgoing and com6 incoming btw

If it uses a port for input, and another one for output, it can't work; Papywizard except the same port for both directions.

If this is true, I can add another param to split input and output...