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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2012 5:30 pm 
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Hi to all, I use Panogear with Papywizard and Tokina 11-16 lens on my Canon EOS 500D. I would buy very soon the T&C because it easyer and faster. I want to buy a fishey lens also. That will speed up my photography but also the processing later in Autopano Giga. Now I have 16 photos for one spherical panorama. With a fisheye lens I will have maybe just 6 photos (4 @ 0° + nadir + zenith). I am looking for few lenses and wold like to hear from other users what would be the best. I need it for real estate and want sharpness. Now, my choice would be something of this:

Canon EF 8-15mm f/4L Fisheye USM
Sigma 8 mm f/3.5 EX DG FISHEYE
Sigma 4.5mm f/2.8 EX DC HSM Circular

My question is: How much images I will make with T&C for a spherical panorama 360x180 ? What lens will give me best risults in sharpness and processing in Autopano Giga.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2012 6:26 pm 
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If you are planning to shoot real estate sphericals with a fisheye lens to speed up your photography then I'd recommend that you use a manual pano head rather than the Panogear.

It will be quicker and easier to set up and shoot with a manual pano head and the nadir shot (if you wish to make one) will be easier to shoot and the nadir foot print of the pano head will be smaller.

Robotic pano heads really come into their own when you are shooting medium-high res.spherical, or more typically partial, panos with longer focal length rectilinear lenses.

The T&C controller will cost Euros 299 inc. VAT; a Nodal Ninja 5L (factory irregular) manual pano head will cost approx Euros 368 inc. VAT.

http://www.red-door.co.uk/pages/productpages/nodal-ninja-panorama-head-NN5L-FI.html

Of the lenses you mention I would not recommend the Sigma 4.5mm FE - that one produces a circular fisheye image and does not fully utilise the sensor area.

You could also consider the relatively inexpensive but fully manual Samyang 8mm fisheye (and the many alternatively branded clones), the Sigma 10mm fisheye or the Tokina 10-17mm zoom fisheye.

Will your real estate clients wish to display invidual panos or virtual tours fullscreen and expect to be able to zoom in; or will they never be displayed fullscreen?

The resolution of spherical pano image required will determine which focal length fisheye you will need to use on your Canon 500D.

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Andrew Stephens
Many different Nodal Ninja and Agnos pano heads. Merlin/Panogear mount with Papywizard on Nokia Internet tablets.
Nikon D5100 and D40, Sigma 8mm f3.5 FE, Nikon 10.5mm FE, 35mm, 50mm, 18-55mm, 70-210mm. Promote control.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2012 11:13 pm 
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also possible is the samyang 8mm
http://www.foto-tip.pl/sklep/product_info.php?products_id=1357&language=en
(I bought mine here...)
and samyang homepage:
http://www.samyang.pl/index.php/en/samyang-8-mm-f35-aspherical-if-mc-fish-eye

its hard to beat this price.
its a manual lens - so only partial exif are written or no exif is written (depending used canon mode used)
but its easy to change the data inside autopano to 8mm and the correct crop-factor
Georg

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:10 am 
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OK, but can you tell me how much shots do you need with your Samyang? I mean fro a full spherical panorama.

It is ok to me the result i get with my Tokina 11-16 and it is enough for real estate. The nadir footprint is not a problem. It is not too big. I must have my logo on the nadir because I have the copyright on my presentations and others can`t use it without my consece. It will be possible to look fullscreen and to zoom just a litle. It is enough. Quality is OK. I will post here a link to my page in few days. That you will see the virtual tours I made and give me advices.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 2:07 am 
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osmica wrote:
OK, but can you tell me how much shots do you need with your Samyang? I mean fro a full spherical panorama.

See:
http://www.vrwave.com/panoramic-lens-database/

Quote:
It is ok to me the result i get with my Tokina 11-16 and it is enough for real estate. The nadir footprint is not a problem. It is not too big. I must have my logo on the nadir because I have the copyright on my presentations and others can`t use it without my consece. It will be possible to look fullscreen and to zoom just a litle. It is enough. Quality is OK. I will post here a link to my page in few days. That you will see the virtual tours I made and give me advices.

The resolution of the stitched pano image that you will get with any of the proposed fisheye lenses will be significantly less than you get with your Tokina 11-16mm rectilinear wide angle lens.

_________________
Andrew Stephens
Many different Nodal Ninja and Agnos pano heads. Merlin/Panogear mount with Papywizard on Nokia Internet tablets.
Nikon D5100 and D40, Sigma 8mm f3.5 FE, Nikon 10.5mm FE, 35mm, 50mm, 18-55mm, 70-210mm. Promote control.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 10:53 am 
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Location: Duesseldorf, Germany
osmica wrote:
Hi to all, I use Panogear with Papywizard and Tokina 11-16 lens on my Canon EOS 500D. I would buy very soon the T&C because it easyer and faster. I want to buy a fishey lens also. That will speed up my photography but also the processing later in Autopano Giga. Now I have 16 photos for one spherical panorama. With a fisheye lens I will have maybe just 6 photos (4 @ 0° + nadir + zenith). I am looking for few lenses and wold like to hear from other users what would be the best. I need it for real estate and want sharpness. Now, my choice would be something of this:

Canon EF 8-15mm f/4L Fisheye USM
Sigma 8 mm f/3.5 EX DG FISHEYE
Sigma 4.5mm f/2.8 EX DC HSM Circular

My question is: How much images I will make with T&C for a spherical panorama 360x180 ? What lens will give me best risults in sharpness and processing in Autopano Giga.

Hi!

The Canon 8-15mm is the best lens in my eyes for your purpose. But it´s also the most expensive one.
I also suggest a manual head for what you want to do.

I use a 5D2 with a Canon 15mm for indoor. It gives me 5 shots hor. and 1 shot Zenith which provides 15000px width. The same amount of shots you´ll have using an 8mm on DX - but providing lower resolution of course.

The optical performance of the 8-15mm Canon in terms of resolution/sharpness and CAs is very good! It saves you time for not needing to compensate CAs before stitching.

best, Klaus

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:29 am 
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mediavets wrote:
osmica wrote:
OK, but can you tell me how much shots do you need with your Samyang? I mean fro a full spherical panorama.

See:
http://www.vrwave.com/panoramic-lens-database/

Quote:
It is ok to me the result i get with my Tokina 11-16 and it is enough for real estate. The nadir footprint is not a problem. It is not too big. I must have my logo on the nadir because I have the copyright on my presentations and others can`t use it without my consece. It will be possible to look fullscreen and to zoom just a litle. It is enough. Quality is OK. I will post here a link to my page in few days. That you will see the virtual tours I made and give me advices.

The resolution of the stitched pano image that you will get with any of the proposed fisheye lenses will be significantly less than you get with your Tokina 11-16mm rectilinear wide angle lens.

the database tells about samyang 8mm:

Quote:
•Recommended: (1.5x, 1.6x): 5 or 6 images, every 72° or 60° at -15° pitch, with double zenith shots at +60° pitch (opposed)

personal I feel more confident with the T&C handheld device aproach:

5 or 6 images, every 72° or 60° at +10° pitch, with single/double nadir shots (nadirshots manually or by pointing the head/camera 90° to show to nadir)
Georg

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Last edited by gkaefer on Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 9:39 pm 
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Location: Croatia (Hrvatska)
Thanx guys. I don`t care about the price of the lens. It is for my business and every invested penny will get back. I use resolution 5000x2500 px and it is more than enough for full screen virtual tours. I don`t need a big zoom, just a little. I just want to have less pictures because it will be much easyer to stich panorama of empty apartments (w/o furniture). It is dificult to stich 16 images where few of them are just empty white walls. And I lose a lot of time that way. With 5-6 images I will have good control points in every image and every virtual tour will be finished in minimal time with best stiching.


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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2012 3:36 pm 
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Location: Croatia (Hrvatska)
Hi to all. Here you can see my first virtual tours. I have one problem to solve. People don`t understand how to view in fullscreen. I know it is easy with just one click on the Panotour button but they don`t understand that button. They look the small view and tell wow, perfect, beautifull... It is funny. I must provide about that. I will put an IMPORTANT ALERT on the home page about that and write how to get fullscreen. Anybody have a better idea maybe?
I need to repair many little mistakes in the web and hope my web master will do that this weekend. But virtual tours are ok. I must check also how to add pictures in the virtual tour.
Will I have the same sharpnes with a fisheye lens? My resolution is normaly much more bigger but I made it smaller to 5000 x 2500 px. It is enough as you can see.
And just another thing. If somebody want to buy a real estate in Croatia don`t hasitate to contact me. I have now just few on my web but I have a lot to sell and will put every week something new.
www.8realestate.eu


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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2012 6:37 pm 
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Location: Duesseldorf, Germany
osmica wrote:
I use resolution 5000x2500 px and it is more than enough for full screen virtual tours.

If you want a good quality even on big displays better use 10000x5000px. Shoot RAW and convert them to TIFF for stitching.
Only after all editing save them as JPG and 8 - 10.

This way you will keep good color-qualuty and good sharpness. I suggest a fullframe camera and the Canon 15mm Fisheye (resp. 8-15mm) or Nikon 16mm Fisheye.

The optimum would be a Nikon D800 and the Nikon 16mm FE. You just need 6-7 shots for a full-sphere but get very high resolution for zooming.

When we have locations where zooming is essential i use a Nikon 35mm prime-lens on the Canon 5D2 - gets me 37000px width and alows sufficient zooming-in.

See here - 35mm:
www.360impressions.de/H_M

see here - 15mm Canon-Fisheye:
http://www.360impressions.de/ZuerichBar.html


best, Klaus

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Last edited by klausesser on Fri May 11, 2012 6:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2012 6:46 pm 
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Location: Isleham, Cambridgeshire, UK.
osmica wrote:
Hi to all. Here you can see my first virtual tours. I have one problem to solve. People don`t understand how to view in fullscreen. I know it is easy with just one click on the Panotour button but they don`t understand that button. They look the small view and tell wow, perfect, beautifull... It is funny. I must provide about that. I will put an IMPORTANT ALERT on the home page about that and write how to get fullscreen. Anybody have a better idea maybe?

Choose a navigation template which includes Help - you can use you own help image if you wish - screenshot 1.

Then choose the Help image as the Splash screen - screenshot 2.





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Andrew Stephens
Many different Nodal Ninja and Agnos pano heads. Merlin/Panogear mount with Papywizard on Nokia Internet tablets.
Nikon D5100 and D40, Sigma 8mm f3.5 FE, Nikon 10.5mm FE, 35mm, 50mm, 18-55mm, 70-210mm. Promote control.


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PostPosted: Sat May 12, 2012 1:40 am 
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So I am assuming, the 35mm 1.4G for the FX, and the 35mm 1.8G for the DX..

http://www.nikon.com.au/en_AU/product_details.page?DCRPath=templatedata/en_AU/saleable_product_information/data/Nikkor%20Lenses/FX%20Format/Single%20Focal%20Length/Wide-angle/AF-S%20NIKKOR%2035mm%20f1.4G.xml&CategoryID=gp11zkmv¤tTab=gp11zkn1¤tLink=gp11zkn8

http://www.nikon.com.au/en_AU/products.page?CategoryID=gp11zkmv¤tTab=gp11zkn0¤tLink=gp11zkn5

Huge price difference.. About $200 to $1600..

How many images would be create approx. for a full sphere... DX and FX.. ??

Someone very knowledgeable in creating excellent Virtual Tours suggested using the 28mm AI S 2.8..... I do not think they are available anymore but the AF-S NIKKOR 28mm f/1.8G is.. not sure if this would be suitable.. Priced between the two above..

The 35mm 1.4 on the D800 seems to be the way to go..

Destiny..

PS.. amazingly enough, the Samyang has better optics, apparently, and is 1/3 of the price cheaper..
http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/samyang/35mm-f14.htm

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Primary School Teacher - Hobby Virtual Tours and 3D/360 Object/Product Photographer - Our aim is to create a 3D/360 Virtual Tour Shop/Store with links to 3D/360 degree products. My gear, VR Drive II - D90 - Nikon 10.5 fisheye - Nikon D800 with Nikon-Nikkor 14-24 - NOVOFLEX Magic Balance - Acratech GP Ball-head - Nodal Ninja 4 + RD-16 Rotor - Manfrotto 190CXPRO4 Carbon Fiber Tripod :) :)


Last edited by Destiny on Sat May 12, 2012 11:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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