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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 10:18 pm 
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Message: I am very interested in the Autopano Giga software, however before purchasing I would like clarification on the below, taken from your documentation:

" Save as template...
Autopano saves the links used to create the panorama within a template. This can then be used to create new panoramas with the same configurations.
To re-use a model, you need to specify it in the Group settings (Detection tab) before launching the panorama’s detection."

Using the Seitz panohead we will be repeating the same shot over and over as we move lighting around a room.
Our process is as follows:
Take a complete spherical panorama and have autopano giga stitch and build the photo.
Then another spherical panorama will be taken with strobe lights in a new position.
We want this image to render with the same settings as the previous panorama so the photos can be layered and masked in photoshop. - will your software do this? If so how?
Is this considered a use for the template and if so please explain the use of making and applying a template thoroughly as we tried to use the brief explanation above, but with no luck in applying the template.

If I can receive the needed support, a purchase will be made.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 12:08 pm 
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David,

The use you have of template will not work in your case. There is no way any panohead is being able to get back exactly to the same position which would allow template stitching work.
I would in fact stitch both panoramas in a single one and use the layer editor to make 2 renderings. In that case, you'll have 2 perfectly aligned panoramas, which would not be the case with template.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 1:00 pm 
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AlexandreJ wrote:
There is no way any panohead is being able to get back exactly to the same position which would allow template stitching work.



Hi Alexandre!

Sorry - i cannot agree. All my tests with SeitzVR2, Rodeon and Panoneed (which i have in constant use) proved they are able to re-shoot a panorama
multiple times and provide perfectly overlaying equis - as long as you don´t change anything on the head in between of course.

Using the Panoneed (max. offset: 0,036°/10000steps) i often do a shooting just before, during and shortly after sunset from the same POV for composing them. Sometimes i shoot 5 spheres from the same point by just starting the head five times for overlaying the equis in Photoshop and editing them individually for composing them to one image.
Each time the head starts again from the *very same* position as before. Using the template from ONE of them (in PTGui) all three resp. 5 stitches provide pefectly lay-overs without needing to find and set CPs for the other shoots.

David uses a Seitz. This one is also very precise. The Rodeon definitely is - without any doubt.

I understood David wants to shoot a pano multiple times with different lighting each time in a room using one identical head/camera setup.

best, Klaus


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 3:29 pm 
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I don't agree. Have this test: use 2 images from the same position from the 2 runs of shooting. Layer them manually in photoshop, you'll see the differences. It has nothing to do with stitching, just about mechanics and vibrations.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 8:35 pm 
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AlexandreJ wrote:
I don't agree. Have this test: use 2 images from the same position from the 2 runs of shooting. Layer them manually in photoshop, you'll see the differences. It has nothing to do with stitching, just about mechanics and vibrations.



Which head did you use?

Klaus


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 8:37 pm 
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AlexandreJ wrote:
. . use 2 images from the same position from the 2 runs of shooting. Layer them manually in photoshop,



Did it several times - no problem.

best, Klaus

PD: i´ll run another test tomorrow and will show it here. :cool:


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 2:34 pm 
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klausesser wrote:
AlexandreJ wrote:
There is no way any panohead is being able to get back exactly to the same position which would allow template stitching work.



Hi Alexandre!

Sorry - i cannot agree. All my tests with SeitzVR2, Rodeon and Panoneed (which i have in constant use) proved they are able to re-shoot a panorama
multiple times and provide perfectly overlaying equis - as long as you don´t change anything on the head in between of course.

Using the Panoneed (max. offset: 0,036°/10000steps) i often do a shooting just before, during and shortly after sunset from the same POV for composing them. Sometimes i shoot 5 spheres from the same point by just starting the head five times for overlaying the equis in Photoshop and editing them individually for composing them to one image.
Each time the head starts again from the *very same* position as before. Using the template from ONE of them (in PTGui) all three resp. 5 stitches provide pefectly lay-overs without needing to find and set CPs for the other shoots.

David uses a Seitz. This one is also very precise. The Rodeon definitely is - without any doubt.

I understood David wants to shoot a pano multiple times with different lighting each time in a room using one identical head/camera setup.

best, Klaus


Klaus -
How specifically do you "Using the template from ONE of them (in PTGui) all three resp. 5 stitches provide pefectly lay-overs without needing to find and set CPs for the other shoots." - I find the instructions for making and applying the template unclear.
Thank you for your time!
David


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 7:35 pm 
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david@markowich.com wrote:
… Using the Seitz panohead we will be repeating the same shot over and over as we move lighting around a room.
Our process is as follows:
Take a complete spherical panorama and have autopano giga stitch and build the photo.
Then another spherical panorama will be taken with strobe lights in a new position.
We want this image to render with the same settings as the previous panorama so the photos can be layered and masked in photoshop. - will your software do this? If so how?
Is this considered a use for the template and if so please explain the use of making and applying a template thoroughly as we tried to use the brief explanation above, but with no luck in applying the template.

Hello David,
I share your frustration. The APG 3.5 documentation is IMHO currently unclear and the use of APP/APG template is deceiving.
This issue has a long history on this forum: one wonders why a detection (and therefore a subsequent re-optimization) *needs* to be launched to simply... "apply a template". The subsequent creation of control points is IMO a non-sense because the consequent novel optimization shall defeat the original template main purpose due to inevitable randomness during CP detection/creation. As a matter of fact, no Control Point should be involved at all, only parameters and coefficients values should.

Assuming that the Seitz panohead is precise enough (as Klaus claimed), I would suggest the following workaround:
1) Take for instance the first panorama file of the scene (xxxx.pano) as the master file and you shall use it a "template" (yet not in the current Kolor's way).
2) Open the file with a text editing program (e.g. Textedit.app on the Mac),
3) Overwrite the name of each of the source images by the the name of the **corresponding** image of a new set of images, save the modified text file as a new panorama file (e.g. yyyy.pano).
4) Open yyyy.pano and render the panorama image. You may now overlay (yyyy) panorama image with the master (xxxx) panorama image in Photoshop.
5) Do the same with the other images sets of the same scene.

Hope this will help.

Michel


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 7:37 pm 
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enbilaman wrote:
I share your frustration. The APG 3.5 documentation is IMHO currently unclear and the use of APP/APG template is deceiving.
.................
Hope this will help.

Michel

The OP is now asking about use of templates in PTGui.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 9:39 pm 
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david@markowich.com wrote:

Klaus -
How specifically do you "Using the template from ONE of them (in PTGui) all three resp. 5 stitches provide pefectly lay-overs without needing to find and set CPs for the other shoots." - I find the instructions for making and applying the template unclear.
Thank you for your time!
David


Hi David!

In brief - i´m in very much a hurry:

"2.13. What does 'Apply Template' do?
This copies the settings of another project to the current project, except for the images and the control points. This function is accessible both from the 'Apply Template' item in the File menu, and from the toolbar in PTGui. A template can be any PTGui project. In Tools/Options/Folders&Files, a folder can be configured where you store your templates (on Mac go to the PTGui menu, Preferences, Folders&Files). Then, the template selection dialog will by default open in this folder. There's a little triangle button next to the 'Apply Template' button on the toolbar, which shows a drop down list of all templates in the configured template directory, for quick access.

Templates can be useful for a quick initialization of a project (lens settings, rough alignment of images), although this is usually not necessary since the Project Assistant can figure out the alignment of the panorama by itself.

Another use for templates is when you have an exact reproducable setup (high quality panoramic head with fixed angles). In this case you could copy all settings of a previous project and there would be no need for placing control points and optimizing.

By default, applying a template copies all settings from the template to the current project except for the source images and the control points. In PTGui Pro this behaviour can be modified in the Project Settings tab, section 'template behaviour'.
2.14. Apply Template does not copy the control points from the template. Why is that?
By default applying a template copies all settings from the template except for the actual source images and the control points (see Q2.13). Control points are never copied since they are specific to the source images. For example a control point could originally point to the corner of a building in the template project, but in another project the same coordinates may be in the middle of plain blue sky. In other words the control points are meaningless outside the context of the original images.

If you just need a project to be stitched exactly like the template project, control points are not needed at all. Control points are only used by the optimizer to determine the best image parameters. The stitcher then only uses the image parameters, not the control points. Therefore it's sufficient to apply the template and proceed straight to Create Panorama without running the optimizer."

Source: PTGui FAQ.
best, Klaus


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