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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 1:39 pm 
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mediavets wrote:
My contention is that when the product is named Autopano and makes great play of the auto aspect then one should not have to 'play' with it.


Hi mediavets
Yes, you can understand the "Auto" in Autopano like this way.
On the other side, then you shouldn't play also with a DX lens on an FX sensor.

If I look at the CPs with the 16mm FE it's really ok. With this lens you shoot a zenit image and don't use the extreme corners. Then it's better to use these "centered" CPs.

APG and pano shooting is much too versatile in order to find a simple solution for all cases, isn't it ?

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 1:55 pm 
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lumelix wrote:
mediavets wrote:
My contention is that when the product is named Autopano and makes great play of the auto aspect then one should not have to 'play' with it.

Hi mediavets
Yes, you can understand the "Auto" in Autopano like this way.


I do. What does "Auto" mean to you?

I drive a car with an auto gearbox - I don't then expect to have to change gear manually.

Quote:
On the other side, then you shouldn't play also with a DX lens on an FX sensor.

Why not - when shaved is it any longer a 'DX lens'?

Quote:
If I look at the CPs with the 16mm FE it's really ok. With this lens you shoot a zenith image and don't use the extreme corners. Then it's better to use these "centered" CPs.

And of course shooting that pattern with the Nikon 10.5mm FE on a DX sensor would work just as well.

I dare say that adding a zenith shot when shooting with the shaved Nikon 10.5mm on a FX sensor would also aid the auto stitch in the zenith area.

But you have yourself demonstrated that it;'s possible to get a perfect stitch without that zenith shot if you 'play' with APG. And others have shown that PTGui can do it without one having to 'play' with it.

I don't doubt that APG is capable of producing perfect stitches, it's just that it doesn't seeb able to achieve that automatically as frequently as it should, nor as frequently as PTGui.

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APG and pano shooting is much too versatile in order to find a simple solution for all cases, isn't it ?

But as you yourself point out APG can find obvious CPs when you use the CP Editor that it doesn't find them normal Detect - why is that?

And why can PTGui frequently do it with no fuss when APG cannot?


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 2:06 pm 
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It looks like the kolor-guys have chosen a method to set the CPs something in the middle of the images.
Perhaps there should be a setting to choose if the user want more CPs in the corners.

If I have to do this in an automated process I would search CPs throughout the region of overlap, then do a precalculation and delete the bad ones.

In the case above I get also better RMS when set focal length and distortion calculation to "different".
This way missing CPs are better compensated.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 2:31 pm 
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I note that the images offered as an attachment to earlier post - shot with shaved Nikon 10.5mm FE on a D800 - have been pre-processed with Lightroom.

I t appears that this may have significantly altered the EXIF because APG 3.0.8 fails to identify the lens, but it does identify the lens correctly with unprocessed (straight from the camera) images shot with a Nikon 10.5mm FE on my DX body.

Perhaps this has some impact on stitching quality?


Attachments:
1-ptp2b4-lensid.jpg
1-ptp2b4-lensid.jpg [ 145.04 KiB | Viewed 439 times ]
2-ptp2b4-lensid.jpg
2-ptp2b4-lensid.jpg [ 140.84 KiB | Viewed 439 times ]
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 2:57 pm 
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lumelix wrote:
HansKeesom wrote:
[Don't want to sound arrogant, but in my mind people should have to understand the basic meaning of the terms/words they use when communicating


Hi Hans
Some photographers are more technicians, others are more artists ;)
One of the best photographers I know has no idea of technical terms. But he has a heart for his motives.


Whatever someone is, if you use terms you should at least have a basic understanding of them , otherwise you are just a charlatan.

My experience with artists is that they absolutely know what they are talking about, at least the succesfull ones

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I stitch and render for other photographers. Price: RMS^3, no cure no pay. If you want to concentrate on your business let me do the stitching for you.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 5:00 pm 
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mediavets wrote:
I drive a car with an auto gearbox - I don't then expect to have to change gear manually.


Nevertheless you need to select "backwards", "park" and at least two stages
of "forwards". Don´t you? :cool:

best, Klaus


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 5:28 pm 
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HansKeesom wrote:
My experience with artists is that they absolutely know what they are talking about, at least the succesfull ones



Definitely the successful ones. Usually they work very professionally.
At least the ones i know personally do so.
Gursky for example - Andreas leaerned photography before going to the academy. He´s very good technically AND as an artist.
Tony Cragg learned to handle materials from scratch long time before he got successful.
Peter Lindbergh also learned photography for 2 years after learning to be a decorator and studying art and painting in Berlin and Krefeld.

Being a successful artist or a good photographer you *need* to have plenty of skills for hand-crafting your work.
Being a successful artist you also *need* to find a balance in crafting and visualizing your ideas.

It´s naive to think "an artist" - especially being a photographer - wouldn´t need to have technical skills in what he does . .
He needs to be able to visualize what he thinks for becoming an artist and even more for being sucessful.


best, Klaus


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:05 pm 
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That's funny Andrew... I was just thinking that about the wording... "Auto" PTGui does not use it yet it does it.. APG uses it, but fails to do it..

As for bunching up the control points and ignoring obvious CPs, which I am sure is why we seem to get issues... Kolor are aware of this in fact... It has been taken into consideration with APG V3.5...

Destiny....


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 9:29 pm 
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HansKeesom wrote:
Whatever someone is, if you use terms you should at least have a basic understanding of them , otherwise you are just a charlatan.
My experience with artists is that they absolutely know what they are talking about, at least the succesfull ones


Ok. I know some very very succesfull charlatans! =D

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:50 pm 
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lumelix wrote:
HansKeesom wrote:
Whatever someone is, if you use terms you should at least have a basic understanding of them , otherwise you are just a charlatan.
My experience with artists is that they absolutely know what they are talking about, at least the succesfull ones


Ok. I know some very very succesfull charlatans! =D


So do I and some we try to lock them behind bars ;-)


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 6:44 pm 
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Thanks for this interesting discussion.
I had the orignal problems with Autopano pro V3 and as you know after hours i gave up, no good stich. Peolple here on the forum have no problems with my 4 images. But i think most work with APG, that may be the solution; i just upgraded to Autopano Giga V3 and suddenly there is a almost perfect stitch, out of the box. After some extra control point even the ceiling is good.

But the same Autopano pro works now also perfect with the example pano. So maybe autopano giga has a shared library with APP and better detection or something?

some notice i maybe had a not so perfect alignment of the pano head as part of the problem. Indeed i did my homework again went form 1.85 mm to 1.6mm on a R1.

About the shaving.
Concratulations to Nikon who makes a 10.5 DX lens which has an image circle wide enought to use it on FX camera. For most work the pano's are sharp enought when you need a 10.000x5000 equi or 8000x4000. And the nadir is really very small.
The shaving is....special, 20 minutes sweating and all is done. I heard from someone who has ask Nikon service center to do it if you are afraid to damage your 700,- lens.

Harry


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 9:26 pm 
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emm... in my opinion, SHAME on Nikon for not designing their 10.5mm fisheye where the lens hood cannot be removed...

Destiny....


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 4:16 pm 
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Dear friends,

I am new to autopano pro and giga. I I started working on This software due to the fact that my cameraman abandoned me in the middle of a project. A VERY IMPORTANT one. I have tried to stitch the images so many times and read, view videos and no solutions found.

I would like to know if any of you could help me get this panoramas stictched so I can create the virtual tours with panotour. My deadline is in 3 days and im starting to panic. Can anyone PLEASE help?

You can write me to info(at)kennysilva.com It will be greatly appreciated.

Kenny


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 4:51 pm 
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Hi Kenny
How big is your pano, how many images ?
E.g. you can upload a screenshot so we have a clue about it.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 12:29 am 
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My advice for this project if you have many panos, is to contact Hans, details in this thread, and ask him to help you out.. He does this kind of thing but its paid work service.. Its an option... However, if its just a few, then I will do them for you for free, but others might too..

Destiny..

Mastermedia wrote:
Dear friends,

I am new to autopano pro and giga. I I started working on This software due to the fact that my cameraman abandoned me in the middle of a project. A VERY IMPORTANT one. I have tried to stitch the images so many times and read, view videos and no solutions found.

I would like to know if any of you could help me get this panoramas stictched so I can create the virtual tours with panotour. My deadline is in 3 days and im starting to panic. Can anyone PLEASE help?

You can write me to info(at)kennysilva.com It will be greatly appreciated.

Kenny


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 6:17 pm 
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working on it as we speak. Having my own difficult pano too btw. where is klaus when you need him ;-)


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