Special f/x Within a Pano - Is there merit to this?

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Sun Mar 20, 2011 5:25 am

Hi Gordon.. what a bummer!!... I was sure it would work when I saw the options for it in Flash CS5... I cannot believe it... So, the bottom line is.. why bother creating anything for iDevices since there are just so many restrictions... I love creating content in Flash... I really do not understand why, Flash would look soo cool on an iPad etc... I can go out and buy a crapy mobile... emmm. like mine:lol: and I can put Flash content on it.. Yet I can go out and spend a lot of money on a iPad/iPhone and all I can create is a tacky gifs or something created using script... My husband has just bought a new Blackberry Phone.. it cost over $1000Aus.. mind you he didn't pay that.. its on a phone plan with the deal.. but the point is.. he chose that phone after I told him that the new Apple Phone will not support flash... Soo... since there is sooo much content on the internet created using Flash he chose the Blackberry... This means that all iPad's, iPone's etc users do not get to view Flash content.. Amazing for sure!!! So, now the question has to be asked.. How is html5 going to help.. I do not really understand.... I must be blond!!!

Thank you for sending me this link Gordon... Now I know was waisting my time today... ALL DAY!!!..

D

Hi Destiny, the iPad does not support flash and it's not going to by the look of things.

Read this apple forum Will iPad 2 support flash?
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:K0NBLIRdNxwJ:discussions.info.apple.com/thread.jspa%3FthreadID%3D2769351%26tstart%3D135%26start%3D30+flash+not+supported+on+ipad&cd=7&hl=en&ct=clnk&source=www.google.com



Best
Gordon

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Sun Mar 20, 2011 6:07 am

There was a time whey you could play Flash in the QuickTime player... but not anymore.... I wonder why this is... I am not sure when it stopped but I am sure it was about V6 that it could.... but I was using Windows QT... I wonder if Apply hate Adobe for some reason...

D

[mediavets]

by mediavets » Sun Mar 20, 2011 7:12 am

So, the bottom line is... why bother creating anything for iDevices since there are just so many restrictions...

Only because there are so many iDevices out there.

So, now the question has to be asked.. How is html5 going to help..

Because it will, they say, at some point allow you to create standards compliant cross-platform/cross-browser animations without using Flash.

Last edited by mediavets on Sun Mar 20, 2011 7:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:09 pm

Hi... well... one step forward and five steps back... I am trying to find a compromise with video viewing on a PC, Mac and iDevices.... using the same pano tour...

My thoughts were that even if I managed to get video to work within a pano the video would be too small to view anyway... So my thoughts are to put a link to an new window where the entire frame of the video can be viewed... Unfortunately, when you click on full screen, the movie opens but then its behind the full screen.. I have to make it open to 'self' then it should be ok... I can then put a link on this to go back to the tour... I can also get audio also works in a movie on iDevices but this one is just a test with no audio.. Sorry I keep using the same old pano to do my testing, but its all I have to play with.. no time to take more... Too much experimenting and playing... I still have many more ideas to try out..

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/P2TestPano/P2MovieTest.html

Destiny....

[mediavets]

by mediavets » Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:18 pm

Hi... well... one step forward and five steps back... I am trying to find a compromise with video viewing on a PC, Mac and iDevices.... using the same pano tour...

... I still have many more ideas to try out..

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/P2TestPano/P2MovieTest.html

Destiny....

Two comments - when viewing using Firefox on Windows XP:

1. You seem to be using Quicktime for the video - most Windows users will not have Quicktime installed.

2. I didn't notice any link back from the video to the tour.

Last edited by mediavets on Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:28 pm

What format would you suggest on this??? I thought just assumed that QT was a standard player...

I wil fix the link back.... I will make the html go to 'self' so it does not sit behind the first html page when set to full screen... I will also put the play icon on the iDevice to sit better and bigger...

Thanks for your comments/feedback...

D

Two comments - when viewing using Firefox on Windows XP:

1. You seem to be using Qucktime for the video - most Windows users will not have Quicktime installed.

2. I didn't notice any link back from the video to the tour.

[mediavets]

by mediavets » Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:32 pm

What format would you suggest on this??? I thought just assumed that QT was a standard player...

What other video formats can be displayed on all iDevices?

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:41 pm

Well... iPad supports only mp4 and h.264 video but you can use QT to play them...

The link back to tour is up and working now and it goes to 'self'... but I will have to work out a way of getting the ptp link to go to 'self'.... It all still look tatty since its all just a mockup testing ground... ...

D

[mediavets]

by mediavets » Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:52 pm

Well... iPad supports only mp4 and h.264 video but you can use QT to play them...

Windows default player is the Windows Media Player.

It failed to play the .mp4 fle you use in your example on a PC wihich does not have the QT player installed.

The link back to tour is up and working now and it goes to 'self'... but I will have to work out a way of getting the ptp link to go to 'self'.... It all still look tatty since its all just a mockup testing ground... ...

D

See: http://www.autopano.net/forum/t11559-self-problem

..............

Are you convinced that this project is worth the effort?

It seems to be taking us far away from the 'spirit' of PT/PTP which is to make virtual tour authoring (for the krpano players) easy via a GUI authoring tool, for those who don't wish to hand code the krpano XML control files.

Last edited by mediavets on Thu Mar 24, 2011 2:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Thu Mar 24, 2011 10:57 pm

emm.... why so negative... Its people like who look outside the box in order to extend this great software kolor have developed that give the software more value... I feel there would be merit in having video working in an iDevice and yes its not easy and yes there will be a situations where code has to be edited, but I also feel that those who really need video working in an iDevice would also have the intelligence to change the code and would be happy to do so.... If the software allowed for an easy placement of video into the software then I would not have a need to try....

Since this is the forum thread I began, I do not expect anyone that does not have a need for special effects to bother reading it.... As for taking you away from the 'sprit' of PT/PTP I disagree... I believe its my 'spirt' and determination to enhance and to throw open the door of opportunity in using the kolor software, and to push towards its boundaries of development is a good thing...

I guess when i received an email feedback from a member of kolor team telling me that look forward in the mornings in seeing what I have been attempting is a 'positive' statement...

Sorry if I have taken you away from ''the sprit of this PT/PTP which is to make virtual tour authoring (for the krpano players) easy via a GUI authoring tool, for those who don't wish to hand code the krpano XML control files.''

I guess I am aiming my attention to those who do which to extend the xml code... and no.. I do not think I am wasting my time and yes I really believe its worth the effort...

For those who have a need to put video into an iDevice, even though its not perfect yet and you will have to edit the xml code, you only have to ask and I will send you the step-by-step, easy to understand process in achieving this...

Regarding the Windows Media Player.. Never will it be possible for QuickTime media to play in it, and visa versa...You cannot play AVI movies in a QuickTime player, however, you can play a QT movie on a PC by downloading the QT player for free... My movies are actually mp4 and you cannot play an mp4 through Media Player unless you download some divers so no matter how you look at it, you have to download something with a pc, so why not QuickTime.. This has been done for years.... and since the iDevice we are talking about is Apple, I guess I have to focus on getting it to work on these devices knowing that there is an option for PC users to view the media via the free QT player... There are very few cross platform players, and as we know, Flash is out...

Destiny....

Are you convinced that this project is worth the effort?

It seems to be taking us far away from the 'spirit' of PT/PTP which is to make virtual tour authoring (for the krpano players) easy via a GUI authoring tool, for those who don't wish to hand code the krpano XML control files.

Last edited by Destiny on Thu Mar 24, 2011 11:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[mediavets]

by mediavets » Thu Mar 24, 2011 11:30 pm

emm.... why so negative...

I guess I'm just a grumpy old man.

There are obviously two main categories of potential PT/PTP user.

Those who are willing and able to hack the XML and those who are not.

IF it's Kolor's intention that PTP should be really attractive to those willing and able to hack the XML then I feel they need to provide a krpano licence with PTP and add some features to facilitate such usage - for example, an integrated XML editor, or the ability to integrate a third-party XML editor; the ability to 'preserve' custom code if you later modify and export the tour again; and thorough documentation of how PTPs templates and themes interact when code is generated on export and the structure of the exported code. Altough I' ve written on many occasions that Autopano Tour and now PTP could be perceivd and used as a Rapid Application Development aid for krpano hand coders I'm not aware of many experienced krpano hand coders who've adopted PTP.

On the other hand those who are not willing or able to hack the XML will want many more features to be made available via the GUI. They will not be satisfied with the 'you can always edit the XML' response to requests for additional features in the GUI. I dare say you too would be very happy not to have to hack the XML if the functionality you sought was available via the GUI?

As things stand I feel that PTP is neither one thing nor the other; and I'm not at all sure that PTs current very restricted feature set will prove to be very appealing to anyone.

Last edited by mediavets on Thu Mar 24, 2011 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Fri Mar 25, 2011 12:10 am

Oh, you are not a grumpy old man...!! You just needed a hot young women to put you in your place.

You are right about the kolor software and I think all of your suggestions will come in time, and I also think that the kolor team are looking at all their options and the market needs... Your comments are probably being read by them now and taken on board....Might mean you have gone on their bad boy list!! I think they are not silly people, they probably look at people like us for ideas and inspiration on how to get richer.. I heard a whisper, only a whisper mind you... that they are going to buy me a Nikon D3x SLR Digital Camera with Nikon AF-S Zoom Nikkor 14-24mm f/2.8G ED AF Lens for my birthday...

I think you provide a very valuable contribution to this forum Andrew, but never forget, others have ideas and opinions that might not necessary fit yours... So don't knock it, run with it and see where it all goes...

Destiny X

emm.... why so negative...

I guess I'm just a grumpy old man.

There are obviously two main categories of potential PT/PTP user.

Those who are willing and able to hack the XML and those who are not.

IF it's Kolor's intention that PTP should be really attractive to those willing and able to hack the XML then I feel they need to provide a krpano licence with PTP and add some features to facilitate such usage - for example, an integrated XML editor, or the ability to integrate a third-party XML editor; the ability to 'preserve' custom code if you later modify and export the tour again; and thorough documentation of how PTPs templates and themes interact when code is generated on export and the structure of the exported code. Altough I' ve written on many occasions that Autopano Tour and now PTP could be perceivd and used as a Rapid Application Development aid for krpano hand coders I'm not aware of many experienced krpano hand coders who've adopted PTP.

On the other hand those who are not willing or able to hack the XML will want many more features to be made available via the GUI. They will not be satisfied with the 'you can always edit the XML' response to requests for additional features in the GUI. I dare say you too would be very happy not to have to hack the XML if the functionality you sought was available via the GUI?

As things stand I feel that PTP is neither one thing nor the other; and I'm not at all sure that PTs current very restricted feature set will prove to be very appealing to anyone.

Last edited by Destiny on Fri Mar 25, 2011 1:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Fri Mar 25, 2011 12:44 am

Ok.... for those interested...

I have put the link to 'self' now.... but I cannot work out how to put the iDevice image to distorted="true". I scaled the image up so it looks the same as the PC/Mac version... but at the moment the images is false on distort... not sure if I know how to fix that....

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/P2TestPano/P2MovieTest.html

D

Last edited by Destiny on Fri Mar 25, 2011 1:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Fri Mar 25, 2011 12:53 am

oh.. I forgot... I haven't done it yet but my intention is to take a snap shot of where the movie is located within the pano and then create a skin image around the movie so it looks more like its sitting inside the pano itself when playing... I guess on iDevices, this will be minimum to get the most out of the movie size.. I will also put a full screen option on this for PC and Mac...

Destiny...

Last edited by Destiny on Fri Mar 25, 2011 1:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Fri Mar 25, 2011 4:06 am

well.. the pano background image is now working and looking ok.. I still need to get the image to for iDevice to distorted="true".. I think I need an extra line of xml code for this.. not sure....

Obviously this is all a mock up test, I would expect your tours to look a lot nicer but the merit is there for it to work and work in a way that can look nice considering where there was no hope now there is some and it doesn't look too bad.. Unfortunately if you are using a PC, you will have to download the QT player, which is not a big deal.. The only way of getting a movie to play in a PC is using this player when it is also necessary for the same movie to be viewed using an Apple product.. Its all a bit of a compromise... There are only a few option open to viewing cross platform video... I cannot use swf, or flv, or ShockWave, or even the ActiveX.. Not sure if that will even work, I might give it a go but ever since they change the way the ActiveX was initiated, its been more bother than its worth...

If you need to know how to do all this, I will be happy to tell you for free... Doesn't mean to say I am a cheap girl... I am just kind hearted.. and for all those pessimistic and negitive people out there ...

D

Last edited by Destiny on Fri Mar 25, 2011 4:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:30 am

Hi.... Today I took my iPod with cables and pugged it into a projector at the local library... it looked really good.... I only made the image about the size of a large TV screen to retain some quality but it worked really nicely as I interacted with in using the iPod touch screen... I then took it to the school and plugged it into the interactive white board and to my surprise it worked and interacted on the white board.. very cool.... The only thing I have to remember is to turn off the auto shutdown... I sat there watching the auto rotation spin round the pano... I then clicked on the movie icon and that fired up ok too.... I need to change that movie to one with sound... Its all not perfect but at least it works to a high degree....

I do not see why the movie does not work in the Pano from the start so I am working on that to avoid all the stuffing about.... It will still mean that PC users will have to have the QT player but there is no way round that until html5 takes off I am assuming.....

D

Last edited by Destiny on Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Sat Mar 26, 2011 5:45 am

Hi to anyone interested...

I have managed to get the Mp4, and a QuickTime MOV formats to work inside a pano.. This test is really for Audio.. I cannot get controllers to work at all inside a PC or Mac Pano.. real pain... Also, I need it to stop looping...

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/MOV/P2MovieTest.html

I managed to get it to work in an iDevice but not as most would like... You cannot just play a movie inside a pano on an Apple iDevice... There are issued that I cannot control.. But i might have found a compromise..

This link will open my pano with a movie.. I just have to work out a way of getting a controller on it... I have an idea for that.. when you open the same movie in an iDevice you can click on the images which works like an icon to the movie.. It will not play inside a move on an iDevice.. Audio works on both.... I cannot control the fact that the icon cannot be set to distorted true on that... Is a kolor thing... It would look nicer if it could...

My brain hurts....

D....

Last edited by Destiny on Sat Mar 26, 2011 7:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Sat Mar 26, 2011 11:13 am

Not to worry Andrew, it now opens on any pc and mac.. and... iDevice too... with audio... NO.. its not me in the video... I am more sexy than her...

I have tried to put a controller skin on the pc/mac version, I can do it and it looks good but it will not play after first time round... real pain... I have a few ideas I will try out but not sure.. its all very experimental....

http://members.westnet.com.au/dps/MOV/P2MovieTest.html

D....

It failed to play the .mp4 fle you use in your example on a PC wihich does not have the QT player installed.

[mediavets]

by mediavets » Sat Mar 26, 2011 12:18 pm

Not to worry Andrew, it now opens on any pc and mac..

D....

Or maybe not - here's what happens on a Windows XP system which does not have the QT Player installed:

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Sat Mar 26, 2011 12:33 pm

emm... I forgot to tell you... don't click on the movie... ... that will open the iDevice QT version... You should have been able to see the movie pay with Audio in the normal pano..... But if you click on the movie it will open the QT movie which is in effect the iDevice version, which has to have a link on it because the stupid thing will not open inside the pano when viewing it on an iDevice.. it will only open outside of it... ya, I know, its not great but I think I have run out of ideas.. Oh good I hear you say ... There is only one option in ptp for a link to either/or.. if I could just put it on the iDevice image link then I would but unfortunately it links both....Perhaps kolor might change that later... It just needs an option for adding a link to which version I want... There are in effect two movies.. one for normal pc and mac pano's which is a swf and a second QT movie for iDevices.. I did this to try to avoid the issue of the player...

Thank you for the feed back Andrew... Thought you had given up on my crazy stuff... Careful... I might make you as crazy as me...!!

D

Last edited by Destiny on Sat Mar 26, 2011 12:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[mediavets]

by mediavets » Sat Mar 26, 2011 1:23 pm

There are in effect two movies.. one for normal pc and mac pano's which is a swf and a second QT movie for iDevices.. I did this to try to avoid the issue of the player...

D

I think this demonstrates something I've mentioned before, that the 'one size fits all' approach currently adopted by Panotour Pro makes for ease of use when authoring but also has major limitations and that in future it may be desirable to permit and enable platform specific variations in the way tours behave.

It's probably not sufficient merely to differentiate between Flash-enabled platforms and iDevices, because some Android devices support Flash but lack the 'horsepower' to deliver the same performance and handle the same media as more conventional Falsh-enabled desktops, laptops and notebooks.

krpano offers a devices attribute for the plugin tag but as yet I don't think Panotour Pro makes use of it.
http://krpano.com/docu/xml/#plugin.devices

Last edited by mediavets on Sat Mar 26, 2011 1:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

[Gordon]

by Gordon » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:29 pm

Video works here on WinXp

Best
Gordon

[mediavets]

by mediavets » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:41 pm

Video works here on WinXp

Best
Gordon

There has never been a problem incorporating video and audio in a tour created with Panotour Pro if the tour is played back on Flash-enabled platforms.

What Destiny is trying to do is find a cross-platform - Flash and iDevice - way of offering video and audio in a tour.

As it stands the krpano player for iDevices does not play video or audio.

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Sun Mar 27, 2011 12:25 am

Well thats all true Andrew... and you are very right in saying Video and Audio will not work directly within the pano... Real pain... The only audio format that ptp accepts is mp3 and even as a hotspot it will not work directly.. There are a few audio formats that Apple apps do accept using different codec's but only one can be used in ptp.. I have probably found the best option for viewing video and audio in a iPod or iPad and PC/Mac... You can play audio but you must use a rectangle linked to a url outside of the pano.. iPad and iPod will open that link and play it ok.. You can then use any audio formate Apple accepts.. ACC is a good one but you can also use mp3...

One thing I would like to change in the kolor software is the option to put the url on only the alt image rather than the rectangle itself.. This will eliminate PC users clicking on the movie which will open the url intended for iDevices, only to find they do not have QT player.. Mind you, my husbands notebook/laptop came with QT preinstalled and I have seen many XP PC's with it too.. So perhaps its only a limited issue.. but its not that hard to download anyway and its really handy to have.. So I do not really see it as a problem.. This option of viewing Video and Audio using ptp is really only for those who can handle editing the xml code and are are happy to do it so then can have at least some option of viewing video related to their pano tour project, even if its not the best... At least its an option of kinds... Anyone wanting to do this I will be more than happy to run you through the steps.. It really is not that hard to do... finding out all that you cannot do was the hard bit...

D

Last edited by Destiny on Sun Mar 27, 2011 4:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

[Destiny]

by Destiny » Sun Mar 27, 2011 4:13 am

Thanks for the feedback Gordon.. its nice to know it worked....

D

Video works here on WinXp

Best
Gordon